The Pen Addict 368/transcript

The Pen Addict Podcast Transcript
Episode:	368
Title:	Pen of Deceit
Release Date:	July 17th, 2019
Hosts:	Brad Dowdy Myke Hurley
Guests:	No guests this episode
Additional Information
Official page:	Episode 368
Audio File:	Audio Episode 368
Podcast page:	The Pen Addict 368
Length:	6666 min <br />1.1 h <br /> minutes
Previous Transcript	Next Transcript

Episode Introduction

Myke Hurley: From RelayFM, this is The Pen Addict, episode 368. I'm losing my voice and this episode is brought to you by ExpressVPN, Pen Chalet, and Moo. My name is Myke Hurley, apparently, and I'm joined by Brad Dowdy. Hi, Brad.

Brad Dowdy: Hey, buddy. How are you doing? It got worse when we started the show. Well, any amount of talking for you right now, it's gonna go completely downhill, right? I mean, it's gone. You're done. You're like on the precipice of completely losing your voice. So, my goal today is to have you silenced by the end of the episode by keeping you talking continuously.

Myke Hurley: I feel like I'm letting you down these days. All these guest episodes you're having to do, and now I've shown up, barely able to talk.

Brad Dowdy: Well, look, it's summertime, right? So, this is the July is usually the month that you're gone, I'm gone. Just like family vacation type stuff, right? It's that time of year. So, our schedules get wonky. This is the time of year where I take like the one week off from refill the Pen Addict members newsletter because I take a family vacation. Like, I hate doing that, but it's like, you know, one week a year, it's okay. So, this is usually our month for that. But then we have stuff on top of that, too. Like, I'm gone again next week and things like that. We're just super busy. But I like doing the guest episodes. I like not talking to you, Myke. All right. No, I'm just kidding.

Myke Hurley: I like listening to them. I always do. I always say this every time. I like being a listener to the show.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. Did you happen to catch the episode? Did you listen to the episode that I did with David Parker? Yeah, it was really great. I loved it. I thoroughly enjoyed talking with David. Duh. Right? Right? Yeah. Right. Fig boot on pens. So, on YouTube, his, like, you know, we talk about YouTube and videos and product videos, but I don't watch like a lot of YouTube, but I watch his and he does such a good job. And I just really appreciated him coming on, filling in.

Myke Hurley: I had one of those classic moments of, like, shouting at my podcast app. So, when you were talking about the Rubik's Cube video, and he said there was, like, a special surprise in it at the end, it's because he made the crazy coloring page of us. Yeah. Yeah. I had forgotten that. You couldn't remember it. And I was, like, screaming at, like, Overcast.

Brad Dowdy: Well, it hit me by the end. Then I remembered it. I was like, oh, it was that Boston Globe image or whatever, that Boston World thing. Yeah. That was amazing. So, yeah. But that was a fun conversation just to learn about a whole different side of things than we normally talk about. Right? Like, I write words and record audio. David records videos. It's a completely different animal. So, I wanted to learn about that, and it was really fun. And the feedback on it. Thank you for everyone who reached out. I know David, you know, a bunch of people tagged me in their comments to David, just thanking him for coming on, and that he was super enjoyable on that episode. So, yeah. It was good.

Field Notes Discussion Start

Myke Hurley: But nobody, everyone's waiting. Everyone's waiting for us to talk about the Field Notes. Right? Should we do it now? The National Parks Edition. Yeah. Yeah. There's no point playing the game. The guessing game.

Brad Dowdy: You sure? Yeah. Because you're on record, and rightfully so, as there can be too much Americana for a non-American, right? Yeah. I think this one crosses a threshold, though, right? Is that the feeling?

Myke Hurley: My problem with the Americana, typically, is when it is displayed in such a way that I don't find particularly imaginative. So, like, here's a picture. Right? And they're beautiful pictures, but they don't mean anything to me. Right. But these, it's, what, nine books? Yeah. Incredible, beautiful illustrations, all by different artists. Yeah, nine different artists. It's, I don't have mine yet, but straight up, this is probably one of, if not the best that they've ever done. Like, this is National Crop all over again, right? Oh, yeah. National Crop is what got me into Field Notes. Mm-hmm. Like, this is an absolutely stunning body of work that they have produced. Yeah. Like, even doing things like every three set, in one of the books, they moved the logo.

Myke Hurley: Right. Right? Because the artwork needed it. They put the logo down the bottom. I think that this is just a monumental addition. Like, it's incredible.

Brad Dowdy: They had to be giddy to produce this. Right? Yep. I mean, knowing Brian and Jim. And, you know, for years and years and years, what are we, 10 years into this? Is that where we're at? Into the subscription or eight years, something like that? You know, for years, you know, people would play their own guessing game. Okay, what edition's next? And National Parks was always right. It was like people's, it was either like National Parks, Highways, which they just did recently, and a lot of like bird watching stuff. Right? You know, like the Autobahn Society and, you know, birds and things like that. But National Parks was probably at the top of everyone's list for years. And when you know that your fans are expecting that edition, you better deliver. Right? And I, this, I think like, if you, if you pin me down to like pick favorites, okay, I'm going to pick like one or two editions, like ahead of this for me. Like, what was the space one called with like the little foil stamps and the constellations? You know, that one of the first spaces that they did. Yeah. Like, that is probably like, I would pick that one over this one.

Myke Hurley: Well, Night Sky is still my favorite. Like, because it means, I just love that book so much. Like this, this is, you know, like, this will be many people's number one. And it is got like on mine, like without even having them yet. I know this is like top five. Easy. Yeah. Easy.

Brad Dowdy: This is one of those editions that I would, it's almost like an 11 out of 10 because they went so far above and beyond what the norm is.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. That's so clever. Right? Like this is the edition they decided to bring out after they put the price up. Right. Right. So you immediately get the value because you got three extra books. Right. Like if, if you subscribe now, but like, Oh, they are selling this for $12.95.

Brad Dowdy: Right. Which is normal. But that's crazy though, right? For the past year and a half. Yeah. For nine. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So, I mean, we're both ecstatic about the edition and I mean, rightfully so. And I think, you know, just across the board, people have loving, have been loving it. But I need to talk a little bit more about this, Myke. All right. And non, like, uh, non, like rating, reviewing type thing. I think this pushed me over the edge of my subscription and wanting to cancel it. If those two things can actually go hand in hand. I actually feel like I know why. It's too much.

Myke Hurley: That's what I, it's exactly it. I don't use these and now I'm getting nine of them.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah.

Myke Hurley: I had the same kind of feeling and which is super weird. It's a strange thing to say. Right. I just, I don't use enough of them anymore. You know, I, I will, I will fill a couple of field notes a year. Right. And I love having them and I love my collection. Like I adore my collection, but I don't think I have space to put these nine where I put. Right. Right. And so I'm not, I'm not at the point of wanting to cancel because honestly, I feel like the value is still there for me, even if it's just like art pieces to own. Right. Right. Because I really do feel that way about these notebooks. Like they feel like I'm happy to collect them because I, I feel like I'm amassing this collection of art that means something to me.

Brad Dowdy: Mm hmm.

Myke Hurley: But from a usage perspective, like it, it does highlight, like I'm now going to have some, I mean, and I know that like nine books is, is actually, I think it's like less than I usually get, right? Because you don't, you get like, no, it's, it's more, it's three more, right? Because you usually get six. Yeah, three more. So I'm getting nine. And so it's like, oh man, I don't know where they're going to go.

Brad Dowdy: Right. Right. Like, so, and then we'll have six more coming theoretically in, you know, three months and six more after that. Yeah. And it's like, it's too, and you know, it's at the point now where you can pick and choose and you don't need to subscribe to get all the things, even though if you weren't a subscriber, but I never not want to, that's the problem. This is going to cost, this would cost you $36 for these three issues, right? If you weren't a subscriber, if you did not subscribe and you say, oh boy, these are stunning. I'm going to, I want all three of them.

Brad Dowdy: You're way better off subscribing. And we're talking about.

Myke Hurley: Of course, when I'm saying about a 1295, it's not like nine.

Brad Dowdy: It's stupid. Right. Right. Sorry.

Myke Hurley: Yeah.

Subscription Costs

Brad Dowdy: And so at the same time, I'm like, well, my subscription is like $120 a year. And we're going to talk later about a pen that I've spent, you know, four times that much and didn't, I mean, I kind of blinked. So I don't know, like I'm torn. Like as soon as I opened this, I was like, I can't keep doing this. Like I don't, even though in the money's money and in the grand scheme, you know, a dollar is a dollar and this is good value. But if I'm not using these books and getting hit over the head with nine books, no matter if it's the greatest edition they've ever created is uncomfortable to me that I'm not going to use them, you know, in a decent time span. Right. So, you know, I've got more notebooks than I know what to do with already. And I'm like compounding the situation because of the subscription. So I haven't decided yet, but I mean, it's funny that this was the one that kind of pushed me over the edge just because it's a lot, like it's a lot of books. And like we preach about, you know, only spend money on things you're going to use. And it doesn't matter if it's a dollar or a thousand dollars. If you're going to use it, you know, feel free. Everyone has their different likes and tastes. And I don't feel like I'm getting the value of using them, even if the value of like the dollar is good. So I don't know. It really hit me with this edition. I've been thinking about it for a while. Just, you know, the frequency and the lack of using them. And, you know, I don't need to collect them. And I've got them all, of course, but I don't that's not something that will keep me going. So I don't know. But it also brings up, you know, not subscribing would allow me to buy some other things that they do on the side, which they did this Wilco edition. Are you familiar with the band Wilco? Sure. Yeah, you've certainly heard of them. So they did a concert edition for Wilco where they did kind of the same thing. They did six artists and made six covers for these Wilco notes. And it sold as a six pack, right? And it was sold at a concert. And I'm sure, you know, like it's called the Solid Sound Festival. And we'll put a link in the show notes for those who haven't seen them. But like, I'm a huge Wilco fan. I'm a huge Field Notes fan. I can't buy this edition because I'm not going to use them. But if I didn't have the Americas or the National Parks edition, I've almost called them America, the beautiful edition. Maybe I would like get this set that I would actually enjoy and use. So it's like I can't justify, you know, all of these notebooks. Like that's the position I'm having to take now, which is a little bit weird because like they're firing on all cylinders right now too. So it's a little bit strange.

Myke Hurley: I understand what you're saying. No.

Brad Dowdy: But it like you open that thing and it's just like it hits you, hits you over the head. So, yeah. So I don't know. It's cool. But at the same time, it's great. So, you know, I think I will probably end up canceling my subscription and buying things as I want or need them. So we'll see. I don't don't hold me to that. I don't know how strong willed I am because like I said, I have no plan to cancel mine yet. I know. It's a good deal. It's a good deal. So anyway, we got more stuff to talk about. And actually, I'm going to talk more about Field Notes later in this trip and actually how I use them because they are really, really great. But let's talk about something else that is great, Myke.

Sponsor Segment

Myke Hurley: You mentioned a good deal. I have some good deals for you. I want to talk about Moo, the online print and design company specializing in customizable business cards, postcards, stickers and more for your business. And Moo is having a semi-annual sale right now. It's live by going to moo.com slash relay. M-O-O dot com slash relay from the July 17th to July 23rd. They have 25% off everything. This excludes shipping and gift cards, but it is the perfect time to reorder and stock up or design something brand new. If you need a new business card right now, go to moo.com slash relay. 25% off. Moo doesn't do sales like this very often, so don't miss out. You can check out their full suite of products. I mentioned the business cards, but they also do postcards and invitations, letterhead, stickers, notebooks, flyers. You can seamlessly promote yourself and your brand with Moo and you can count on their quality. They have special finishes like gold foil for their cards. They have silver foil now too if you want to be extra special. Raised spot gloss, letterpress, all of these little touches make you stand out. And like, so for example, imagine you've bought a card like a regular card before and you wanted to, and you're thinking maybe it's time to reorder. You could now reorder and take advantage of these extras because you've got the discount, right? See what I mean? So now take that extra step, put some letterpress on the card and you're going to save money on the overall price anyway and you get to be extra fancy. And if you don't, like if you don't have your own design or you don't have a designer for your, to make your own card, Moo recently rolled out a bunch of gorgeous templates for business cards inspired by their most creative customers. So you can have Moo help you build and then produce that beautiful card as well. So once again, that is moo.com slash relay, M-O-O dot com slash relay, R-E-L-A-Y. Go there now to save 25% off. Thanks to Moo for their support of this show and all of Relay FM. Yeah, and that's 25% off their notebooks too that we always read about. That is worth it. You got to sell those out.

Myke Hurley: Talk about sellout. Well, that sounded bad when I said it.

Brad Dowdy: Accurate. Accurate.

Myke Hurley: It was meant to be good because they've done so well as always.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, yeah. So this is a very on-brand episode and you knew we were going to talk about Field Notes. You also know we're going to talk about the Mark I Apollo edition, right? I mean, it's pretty clear that our friends Dan and Tom from Studio Need, who you also have a podcast called Thoroughly Considered on the Relay FM network, which we will talk about momentarily. Tell you to talk about making stuff. But they did the Mark I pin, which we talked about a million times on this show and how much I love it, you love it. And, you know, we've been talking with them, God, it seems like years now on that, on the pin. And it finally came to fruition earlier this year. And they always keep something like in their back pocket that they kind of drop on us later in the game. Like we were early in the game on the standard Mark I. And then like a couple of weeks ago, I get a message from Dan. He's like, hey, check this out. I'm like, you dirty dog.

Brad Dowdy: So they created the Mark I Apollo edition to go along with the 50th anniversary of the Apollo 11 mission to space, which is ongoing right now. And they did a lot of interesting things with this. Can you can your voice handle recapping this? Because you've talked about them specifically on Thoroughly Considered episode 52, which we'll have a link to the show notes. And can you give the big picture?

Myke Hurley: So basically what they wanted to do was create something that could commemorate the Apollo 11, right? And the moon landing. So this is something that Dan has wanted to do since before the Mark I was even available. Like this was an idea that he had. He wanted to make a space pen, right? Like a pen about space. And this one actually ships with the Fisher space pen refill, which is nice. Like that's the way they should do it. It will still fit the Schmidt refill. But this just makes sense to put a space pen refill inside because the Mark I can take that anyway.

Brad Dowdy: Your best question in the podcast was in the beginning. You said, is this a space space pen or a space space pen? Yeah. And it's the perfect question for nerds like us.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. And it is a space space pen.

Myke Hurley: Clearly. And this one. So the Mark I is a Cerakote on aluminum, right? That's how it's usually made. But they wanted to try something different. So the Apollo edition is made of stainless steel with PVD coating. PVD coating is what went on the old Apple Watch. Remember like the black Apple Watch? That was PVD coated. So this is a completely different from a weight perspective. It's a much heavier pen. Significantly different in that regard. And that was something they heard from people. Some people like a heavier pen. And this is it, right? So it's like very different in production for them. It looks as a beautiful etching on it. But it looks the same. It's the same pen. Same mechanism. Made of a different material. And the fun thing is, and I think this is genius, this pen is only available on Kickstarter for eight days. They are timing it exactly from the launch of the shuttle to when it comes back to Earth. So July 16th to July 24th. They've met their goal. They had a 20 grand goal. Smashed it day one. They're at 48 grand now. I'm not surprised because the Mark I is a fantastic pen. And this is just like a beautiful limited edition version of it. I'm using mine today as well. It's just an excellent pen. I kind of had to, right? It's like one of my favorites. They just absolutely crushed it. And now I'm really pleased to see that they're doing weird and different things with it. And I'm really intrigued for a stainless steel version of this. Because I think it's Dan or Tom, one of them described it. It's basically indestructible. Which is also kind of a nice little thought. But yeah, I'm really excited for it. I think it's awesome.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, so stainless steel.

Myke Hurley: I have a question for you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I have a question for you. Sure. Because they were saying this to me. So they're selling this for $110. What do you think of the price?

Brad Dowdy: So it's completely fair. And it's not just because of the stainless steel. For some reason, and the one thing I don't know the pricing of is the coating. And so all the finishing work that has to go into the stainless steel to give the mirror finish is extra work, right? And the stainless steel material is harder to machine because it's thicker, heavier, stronger. So all of those increase your costs. So stainless steels are always a premium. They're usually premiums over titanium pins. It's usually like aluminum, titanium, stainless, and then brass and copper are kind of the more premium materials. So stainless steel is more expensive. It's denser. It's harder to machine. And then the PVD coating, for some reason, is very expensive because it makes your pen kind of ding-proof, right? It's not like bulletproof. Like if you throw it against the concrete, it's probably going to scratch up. But it's not going to like ding or dent. And, you know, there's only a few pen makers that I know that do the PVD coating. I think Ian Schoen does with Schoen Design. And his pens run upwards of $200, I think, with that coating. I could be wrong. I didn't look it up beforehand. But for some reason, whatever the chemicals are and the process is to apply that coating is very expensive. So PVD-coated pens are easy to find. And when you do, you pay a premium for them. So that in combination with the stainless steel, I didn't really blink at the price. It's accurately priced. Like I don't – like I listen to the show and like when you're designing products, no matter how much it costs you to make the product, there's still a number that the product will sell at and won't sell at, right? Like I don't think it's a $175 pen. Like you end up saying, no, let's not make that product, right? Right. Because you don't think it is –

Myke Hurley: Even if the margins were the same as what their margins are, it doesn't matter because it's what the market will support.

Brad Dowdy: Right, right. So you look – like we talk about that with our pen cases a lot. And it's like if I look at like our Brasstown pen case, which is like our most expensive case to make, it's like I don't – it's not a $75 pen case, right? No matter how much it costs us, it's just like it's not that thing. Even if it costs you $74.99 to make it, it doesn't matter. Right, right. It doesn't matter, right? So that's the way I look at things. So I think it's great. I love it. The price is fair. Like it's not an inexpensive pen. You know, you're paying a premium for the materials, the machining of the materials, and the coating. And I think –

Myke Hurley: And limited edition nature. They're only selling it now, right? And like you can't deny that, right? Like that's the thing. You pay extra for limited products.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, but I don't weigh that into is it the correct price or not, right? Like I don't weigh that as part of it. Although I'll probably go against that later in this show when I justify my insane purchase that I made. Right.

Myke Hurley: I mean, I don't know if they've done this, but I know like I would. Yeah. You can build that into your price if you want to. Totally.

Brad Dowdy: Totally agree. Totally agree. So yeah, I think it's great.

Pen Materials Discussion

Brad Dowdy: Stainless steel is one of my personal favorite pen materials. Like aluminum and titanium and stainless are kind of my jams. And they talked about why they don't do brass. And they didn't mention copper, but it's in the same category as brass. It's too heavy and it's too soft. And you wouldn't sell enough of them to like make it worthwhile. Well, I was talking to them about it as well.

Myke Hurley: It's like we were talking about all the materials that they could have used. And ultimately, some of them make no sense because you're covering it. Yeah. There's no point doing brass if you're going to cover it. Right. Because people like the way brass looks, right? Right. If you're going to PVD cover. But like is it even like looking at either titanium or stainless steel? Yeah. You're better off going stainless steel. Because you get most of what you want, like the weight and the strength. But if you're going to cover it with PVD coating, it doesn't matter what's underneath as much. It's like the same as they go with aluminum for the regular one because they're going to set or coat it. Right. So the material that's underneath the coating, it just has to have some of the properties that you want. It doesn't need to be the best material. Or like I'm not saying stainless steel is a great material.

Brad Dowdy: Oh, yeah. It's one of my favorites. But you don't cover brass and copper because they patina. And the purpose of those pins is that their characteristics change the more you use them. Right. And they look better the more you use them. You don't cover that with something to not do.

Myke Hurley: In my opinion, like brass and copper have no other benefit really. Because you can get stuff that's heavy. Right. Sure. And whatever. But like it's the color changing. And if you like it, the smell.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. And I mean, people like the copper because of the antimicrobial properties. You will actually get a few things. But that's edge case stuff. Right. That's edge case stuff. So I love the logo. Honestly, that's probably the PVD coating and the logo sold me. As much as I love stainless steel, I love that little logo. It's the shininess for me. The little landing module logo is dope. I said in our show notes, I need a t-shirt with that on it, please. Dan and Tom. Oh, yeah. They should do that. Because I think Dan drew it. So. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So. And like the timing was great for me. Right. I was on vacation last week, which we're about to dig into like what I use for a travel kit for that. And one of the stops in Florida was at the Kennedy Space Center. I won't go as far as saying it was like life, a life changing experience. But like we did things like go to Key West and swim in the clear blue waters and like have awesome beach time and really cool stuff. And I'm not sure I took more out of this trip than our visit to Kennedy Space Center. And I think my wife would agree with that. It really knocked our socks off just in the size and the scope and importance of what NASA and the space program has meant to this country. And like it really hit home with us on that visit. Like we're of the age. Like our kids didn't get as much out of it as us because they don't know the space program like we do. Right. And I'm not a space nerd by any stretch. Like I don't listen to Liftoff, our wonderful podcast on Relay FM with Stephen Hackett and Jason Snell. Like I don't get into that level of nerdery on the space program like a lot of people do. But I get it. Like this, it was like an eye opener trip. And it was, it was fascinating. And we got to see the Fisher space pen display at Kennedy Space Center. They talked about like all the different models of pens and things that the astronauts use. And I took some pictures of that. So that was cool. And, you know, after the, I hadn't listened to the podcast 13 Minutes to the Moon, which is done by the BBC. I don't know if you've listened to that, Myke, but it's a really neat podcast series about the Apollo 11 mission. So like all of this lined up together perfectly for me to like back this pen and go to the space center and do all these things. Like I'm eat up with space right now. So it's kind of a good time. If you're a space space fan, it's a good time to be alive and getting to celebrate the 50th anniversary of the Apollo 11 mission. So it's pretty cool.

Topic Shift - Travel Gear

Myke Hurley: All right. So you're talking about your trip. Yeah. What was your stationary outfit?

Brad Dowdy: So I did a specific kit knowing, well, let me back up first. When we went to Chicago a couple of years ago to do our field notes interview, I added on some days there and took the family because we had never been to Chicago and we want to just kind of like hang out and, you know, see the city and do things. And I made it a goal that trip to take a pocket notebook with me and to record my trip in it. And number one, just to see if I could do it because I thought it was a good idea, but could I actually do it? Was that my thing? And I ended up really, really enjoying doing that because I don't do that enough. Like I don't capture my daily life. Like I don't journal, right? We talk about planners and, you know, we're going to talk about planners a lot in our next episode as a matter of fact, but I don't really journal. But when I go on a trip, I have that opportunity, one, to do it and two, because I want to capture those memories. Like I can write those things down. Like I can take all the pictures with my phone as, you know, as I want, but it really sticks more if you write things down. Like I think that's pretty clear to anyone who listens to this show. Like we like to write things down. So I planned on doing that for this trip through Florida. So what we did was basically road trip from north, northernmost Florida to southernmost Florida and back in our car with the kids. You know, I don't know that we would do it again, but we had like an epic trip. Like it was totally like Griswold vacation family truckster mode, you know, unloading and loading every night, like it is staying in a different place, seeing new and different things. And so I wanted to capture that. And back to the Field Notes perfection, like I didn't know what notebook I was going to take for about like five minutes and it hit me. The Field Notes coastal edition had a Florida coast cover. And I was like, well, it's pretty clear that that's going to be the one I take. Right. So I needed a pocket. I wanted a pocket notebook because I didn't want to carry around many things. And if I wanted to, I just wanted to throw it in my pocket to capture notes on. And then I had to think about what pens am I going to take? So I need a pen to write with. So I didn't want to take a fountain pen because unlike you, I hate fountain pens and field notes on most of their paper and I refuse to use them. So it was actually a pretty easy choice to take a spoke pen with the 0.5 black gel Uniball Signo DX because that's just a good writing pen. Like I can write and write and write. And the one bad thing about the Field Notes coastal edition is the reticle grid is really strong. It stands out a lot. You need a pen to override the density of the dark reticles on the page. Um, so I wanted a black ink to do that. So like I way overthink this. Like, do you like I, I seriously like overthink what I carry because I'm a nerd that way and I want to do it right. And I want to enjoy what I'm using. So I decided that was the pen. I also need a pencil on this trip because sometimes I'll do a little bit of sketching. I didn't have that much time to sketch. And like with the kids, it's hard to like, I can't sit down for 15 minutes and sketch a building, right? It's like super hard. They're not going to sit down, but I still take a pencil just in case. And I don't take a wooden pencil, but I take the Cron Dash Fix pencil, which I think is pretty much a given. If you've known me for any length of time, that's one of my favorite products of all time. Yep. Big fan. And then if those are my two main writing instruments, I need a little bit of color for notation, for highlighting, for coloring, for just side notes. And I went through a bunch of pens to pick out the Pilot High Tech C, the mica edition, which was a different edition they did a few years back. Same refill, different barrel design. And I picked out a bright blue and a bright pink to take on that because, you know, Florida and brightness and fun and neon, like, like it's the right, it's the right colors. I also took a Sakura Pigma Micron, which I ended up not using. Probably didn't need to take that. I used it like once to like, maybe twice and once to like draw on the cover of my notebook. And then I took a small roll of pink washi tape because like, if we go and do something and have a ticket or have a receipt or, you know, have an armband or something, I'll tape those into my little notebook. So that's how I do it. And I packed that all in the Unicorn Snot Notco Sinclair, which is the pink and the blue and pink one. Like I went full Miami Vice for this trip, Myke. I don't know if you have to, right? I mean, number one, these are colors I love to begin with. And number two, I mean, Florida, bright blue, Miami, Key West. Yeah. So I did it themed, right? This was like kind of all in my theme. And I'm like stupidly happy with what I did. I don't know why. I just get the biggest kick about it. It's like, man, I really nailed that travel kit, didn't I? I'm like super proud of myself. But it's probably because I used it and all of it worked, right? I think in that Field Notes notebook, I think I have like three empty pages. So in the span of a week on a driving trip through Florida, I filled the entire notebook, you know, single page, you know, not front and back, you know, just one side of the page. Sure. So it's like everything I wanted. And I like, I'm going to keep this little kit together. Like I'll have to take out the spoke pen and the fixed pencil because I use those more than, you know, than I'd be able to leave them in this case. And like, I'll take a bunch of pictures and elaborate this more for like Pen Addict members refill this weekend. I'm going to go through and like scan my notebook and show you how I use these things and do all that stuff. But I just like the idea of packing specificity, if you will. It's like I could take just a bunch of random pens and paper and figure out what I use when I need to use it or I'm going to use it. But this limits my options while giving me the things that I need to accomplish what I want to if I'm going to write or draw or capture things during the trip. And, you know, like the decisions were made. I didn't have to like question anything. I didn't have to dig through a bag. I could just reach in and grab my Sinclair and all the things were in there, including the washi tape, which fits in there. And I don't know. I, I'm just like stupidly happy with how this turned out. And now I have a notebook. Like I have my Chicago notebook. I'll now have this Florida trip notebook and I keep those things and, you know, I can refer to them later and read all the notes I put in there and just kind of relive the trip. So it was fun. Um, I gave myself a high five for this kit. Um, I think I nailed it and, uh, I want to use it more. I like doing things like this. So it's fun to me.

Myke Hurley: Yeah, that's cool. I took, uh, on my trip, I took, uh, my Brown Sinclair, which I love, which I had, I had a couple of field notes in there. Oh, I had one field notes, one story supply notebook. Um, I don't remember. What's that one called? That pocket notebook. You know, one of the red ones.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. The red, uh, I want to call that one the four 20 edition, but it's not that it's, I think it's a number. I can't remember. The red one. It's really good. Yeah. Wonderful. And it's, it's really good with fountain pens. Exactly what I was going to say.

Myke Hurley: And I took like the most ridiculous set of pens with me. So the Capeco student. Sure. The, uh, I took the Japan blue crazy sailor. Yep. Right. Cause absolutely adore that thing. Uh, my 1911 King of pen and, uh, kind of lay out Eolani, the new one. Nice. So I took on my trip. I barely used them, but really, I wouldn't. I wanted to show, I wanted to show them to Tiff. Yeah. She hadn't seen them yet. Nice. I wanted her to see those pens cause I love them and I know that she'd appreciate them.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. Yeah. And that's a good kid. And, but like you said, like once you start taking multiple fountain pens and you're on vacation, you're not sitting there writing all day. It's like, well, am I really going to use all these things? So that's kind of how I tried to, you know, set the rules when I was packing. Right. You only take the things I can use, limit myself to what fits in this case, which you did too. Like you didn't over pack. Like you didn't take like three pen cases, but you also took things that you ended up not using. No, I took stuff to show.

Myke Hurley: Right. Right. Like I have my journal with me in case I wanted to do that, but you know, I never typically do it in my journaling on vacation and it was the same this time.

Brad Dowdy: Right. And it's funny. I only journal on vacation.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. It's weird. It's weird.

Brad Dowdy: Maybe that's why I'm so excited about it because it was such a different thing for me. Right. It's, it's, it was out of my norm to, um, before I go to bed every night to sit there and write for like a half an hour, sometimes, sometimes more like that is abnormal for me. Big time, big time. I never do that.

Myke Hurley: So it's a nice vacation activity though.

Brad Dowdy: Yes. Yeah. It's, it's, and you know what? It's probably mandatory for my sanity, right? I can check out like at the end of the day when like everyone's on edge anyway and tired and exhausted because we've just been go, go, go. And we all like everyone jumps on their devices and I jump in my notebook and it was good.

Myke Hurley: All right. Today's episode is brought to you by Pen Chalet. They sell authentic, amazing, wonderful fountain pens, roller balls, ball points, mechanical pencils, and so much more from your favorite brands. Pen Chalet runs special discounts twice a month, close out specials every two weeks. They are always adding new styles of pens. It's always new stuff going on there. I find recently like if there's something cool that I want to check out, Pen Chalet's got it. And what's really great about that is because as a pen addict listener, you can always get discounts for Pen Chalet, which I'll tell you about in a moment. As well as having the writing implements themselves, Pen Chalet also has carrying cases, pen holders, refills, fan-to-pen converters, so much more. And they back everything up with fast and reliable customer service. They do free shipping on orders of over $50 in the United States, and they sell internationally as well with reasonable shipping rates. I think their rates are great. Pen Chalet has low prices and high quality pens, and they offer a 100% satisfaction guarantee. Pen Chalet.com. So go to penchalet.com. P-E-N-C-H-A-L-E-T.com. And click the podcast link at the top of the website. Use the password penaddict, and you will be able to get the code that you need to save 10% on anything at Pen Chalet. And access this time to a special Pen Addict-only pre-sale of an upcoming inventory reduction that Ron's doing over at Pen Chalet. He's got some stuff that he wants to clear out, but he's going to be doing a big sale for it. But Pen Addict listeners, get first dibs.

Brad Dowdy: I was wondering what was up, because I haven't hit the bottom of the list yet. I've never, ever seen anything like this from Ron and Pen Chalet. Let me see if I can actually get to the bottom, just speed scroll at this point. Oh, there's just a lot of cool stuff. Okay, I'm finally there. And I hit the bottom, and it says, view more specials.

Myke Hurley: Yeah.

Pen Discussion Begins

Brad Dowdy: There is an insane amount of stuff. There's a couple things that stand out. He must have found some back stock of the Retro 51 Chiopino Rose Gold Tornado. Did you buy that one? The kind of like Abalone shell? It's one of the best ones. I didn't think those existed, and he has them on this page. Look at that price. Oh, my God. Look at that price. It's... Yeah, it's not right. Holy moly. Ron, you ain't right. All right.

Myke Hurley: Seriously, you gotta go get this. That is a wild price for that pen.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah, if you ever wanted that pen, it doesn't show up. That was like two years ago, I think. So I doubt he has many. So anyway, this list is never ending. There's some really cool Leonardo's on there, which I'm a big fan of. There's ink. There's a great price on Pelican. Good. I mean, you just have to go look. Like, we tell you this all the time, and you probably ignore us, you know, most of the time because you're not in the market for a pen. Something on your wish list might be on this page because it's exhaustive.

Myke Hurley: It's... Oh, man. The Platinum.

Brad Dowdy: It just keeps going. I didn't even see the Platinum. I can't believe it's on here. Yeah. I didn't even see the Platinum. So it's a lot of stuff.

Myke Hurley: I don't even want to say what one it is in case it'd be bad to say.

Brad Dowdy: Oh, yeah. Oh, I see. Do you see it? Well, there's a... Yeah. It's right next to another pen that is always fascinating. It's right next to a pen that I talked extensively to David Figboot about last week. Those prices are wild. Yeah. All right. We should stop. You should shop. All right.

Myke Hurley: Run straight up. Lost it. Go take advantage of that. You can go right now. PenShellet.com slash... Oh, no. PenShellet.com. Podcast link at the top of the website. Password Pen Addict. To get your hands on this stuff. Thanks so much to PenShellet for the continued support of this show and RelayFM.

Brad Dowdy: I can't buy anything from PenShellet, Myke, because I cheated on you. You... I can't believe you. I mean, I'm coming clean. I'm making a confession. I feel kind of dirty. I feel a little bit guilty. What happened to us?

Myke Hurley: What did I do to you? Is it because I keep not showing up?

Brad Dowdy: You know, my standard excuses, you know, we were just busy and lots of things going on. And, you know, you were here. I was there. And things just kind of happened. And then all of a sudden, you know, I had my credit card out and a pen is coming from me from Japan coming to me. And I didn't let you know about it. And do you still love me?

Myke Hurley: This is your pen of deceit. This is how I'm going to remember this.

Myke Hurley: What is going on with this thing?

Sailor Rialo Topic Introduced

Brad Dowdy: So, you know, I've wanted a Sailor Rialo, right? I know. Yeah, yeah. I remember we wanted one. You two. You two.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. Let's be clear. You two.

Brad Dowdy: So, the issue that I have always had, and I think you're on the same wavelength, is there's never been, like, the right design to spend the money on. Yeah. Um, they don't have the. I have a black one. I got a good deal. Yeah. But they don't have the expansive colorways like they do in Sailor's other lineups. Um, even the King of Pen. Like, the King of Pen has more cool stuff in it than the Rialo lineup. Um, and it's not even close to, like, the Pro Gear and 1911 lineups. Like, that's, it's, the Rialo is pretty much a second-class citizen. Because it's kind of expensive relative to the rest of the product lineup. And what you're paying for, if you're not familiar with the Rialo, is you're paying for a filling system. It's a piston filler, which is unlike any of Sailor's other pens. Even the King of Pens are cartridge converter pens. So, the Rialo is different in that way. And I don't own one. And, because I haven't found a style that I've enjoyed. So, we've talked about it a bunch. And I've had a bunch of people send me different links of different Rialos over the past few months. And then a friend in Japan had tipped me off to a group called the YY Pen Club. And he said, they're coming up on their 10th anniversary. They usually always do a Rialo. Here's a picture of all the ones they've done in the past. And I'm like, oh, those are cool. And, you know, they've done some neat stuff. And, you know, it's nothing I could get or anything like that. They're all long, long sold out. It's a smallish, smaller club. I mean, sure, it's large compared to things we're used to in the U.S. and the U.K. But it's a very specific small club. And he sent me the link to this one. I was like, I'll let you know when the 10th anniversary one comes out. And we'll see what it looks like. And he sent me the link. I'm like, yep, that's the one. And so it's basically a clear translucent Rialo with a metal section and a frosted cap. So it's kind of got a, for a clear crystal looking pin, it's kind of got a lot going on. Just a little bit of extra fit and finish that's outside the normal. It has the YY pin club across the cap band. It's got like a very sleek nib, you know, not much stamping or things on it. I love the look of it and like the grip section and the cap. I don't know. It's kind of like my Rialo. And so he said, he gave me their email, told me to reach out to them. He said they're generally good to work with through email. So I did. And they were. And it was actually too easy for me to part with about 500 U.S. dollars for this pin that they've made like 60 of for their club in Japan. And it's not here yet. It's shipped. So who knows how long.

Myke Hurley: Why can't we make a Sailor?

Myke Hurley: I don't understand. I want to make a Pro Gear, right?

Brad Dowdy: All we need, I guess I just haven't worked on the contact. It sounds like I would have to go.

Myke Hurley: If they made like 50 or 60 of them. Yeah. We could do that.

Brad Dowdy: Oh, I know. And Bung Box, I don't think they make more than that quantity on their pins. They're not making like hundreds. No. I don't think. Like we could totally do that. Come on, Sailor. I think we just have to go outside the U.S. I don't know if the Sailor distributors in the U.S. would work with us on that. Would we have to go around them? So I don't know. Maybe we'll. That's one of those things.

Myke Hurley: That's a life goal.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah.

Myke Hurley: Yeah. Right. We make a Pro Gear together.

Brad Dowdy: So maybe when we take our trip to Japan, it'll be to pick up those pins. Yeah. You know, that'll be our. That's our life goal. That's the end game. End game for the Pin Addict podcast. And we're done at that point.

Myke Hurley: What else is there to do? Go to Japan. Pick up our custom Pro Gears. Shut it down.

Cheating on Myke

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. So we're never done. We're never done. So I cheated on you, Myke. I don't know what my justification was. I was like, Myke probably won't really like love this pin. So I probably just won't even. I'll say. I will say.

Myke Hurley: This doesn't particularly float my boat. Right. Yeah. Yeah. This is. I would buy this. I would not $500 buy this. Right. One of my problems is the YY Pen Club logo. Which is a bad logo. Yeah. It's not the best logo. Being printed on the band. What's that?

Brad Dowdy: What's that? What is that logo font? It's like the. It's like Rocket Pizza from Toy Story logo. Yeah. It's not good. It's what it brought to me up. It's not good. But the way the band looks. And I think it's okay. Like that's my least favorite part. I'll admit that. But just the overall style of the pin. I like. Like I won't even. I mean. Look at the cat band.

Myke Hurley: Looking through their Instagram. I think that there are other pens that I like more. Yeah. They did a pink 1911. Like a pinky purple 1911. With gold. Like dust. Like brushed gold finish. Yep. Yep. That thing is. That was like what? A couple of years ago or something. Mm-hmm. I thought it was in May. They did it in May. Yeah.

Brad Dowdy: They do a lot of custom stuff. It's like constant. What is going on? I should email them. Say hey. Hey. Give me your contact. Yeah. I'll email them.

Myke Hurley: We could sell so many of these. Like.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. It would be wild. Yeah. There's like a blue sparkly Rialo going around. With gold trim. That a bunch of people sent me. Like if that had rhodium trim. I would have bought that in a second. But it's got too much gold for me.

Myke Hurley: Can you imagine the trouble we could get ourselves in. If we could just have the ability to make any sailor we want. Configuration wise. Yeah. It'd be bad. Can you imagine? I mean at least. It'd be good for us.

Brad Dowdy: It'd be bad for our listeners.

Myke Hurley: Because yeah. I mean it'd be fine for us. Because we'd probably be able to pay it all off. But like. They have some 1911s with like. A ribbed plastic body. Right. What is going on?

Brad Dowdy: They made those several years ago. Yeah. Sailor did those. Many many years ago. Did that stuff.

Myke Hurley: They've got one like. Done recently.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. So that's not the only Rialo. Come on Silo. Heading my way. I have another Rialo heading my way too. They just kind of lined up. In the same way. That I paid much less for. And a more reasonable amount. Okay. Of money. I will let you know when that one arrives. But it was a second hand. Second hand Rialo. Which probably should have been the first Rialo I bought. Right. To see if I even liked the pen. Before I spent all the money on the big one. But you know. I you know. I didn't listen to my own advice. And got FOMO'd on that one. But I'm looking forward to it. Hopefully we'll have it like. Next week. Or the week after. And I can talk about it. And then you know. Like I need to stop buying pens. You know. And I say that. And we got the San Francisco pen show. That's going to be a huge problem. For me. Buying stuff. Because we got lots of great Japanese vendors. And that. And lots of other vendors from Asia. At that show. So. Good times Myke. Good times. Sorry. I cheated on you.

Myke Hurley: I can look. I can forgive you.

Ask TPA Segment Begins

Myke Hurley: All right. Should we take a break. And do some Ask TPA?

Brad Dowdy: Yep. And let's. We'll save your voice. And we'll get to some Ask TPA. I'll read all the questions.

Myke Hurley: I think you're going to have to. Tonight's show is brought to you by ExpressVPN. You might think that nobody wants your online data. Or to snoop on you. When you browse the web. Without anything to protect your privacy. You are looking at risks. You could have hackers. Or advertising companies. Even just wanting to collect. Your data. It happens to people like you and me. Which is why I use. And recommend ExpressVPN. It runs in the background of your computer. Or your phone. Encrypting your data. Hiding your public IP address. You just download the app. Click to connect. And you're protected. ExpressVPN is rated the number one VPN service. By TechRadar. And uses cutting edge technologies. New. Called trusted server. To make sure there's no logs. Of what you're doing online at all. It costs less than $7 a month. And comes with a 30 day money back guarantee. I always use ExpressVPN when I travel. So I have it there with me on all my devices. So I know that when I'm connecting to Wi-Fi networks. That I don't trust. I just get the peace of mind. Really like. I don't know what. I don't know the exact risks that are out there for me. But I would prefer to have none of them. And ExpressVPN is so easy. And it's so fairly priced. I might as well just go for it. And I do. And I'm happy with it.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. I pretty much had it on my entire trip. Because we're in a different hotel. Almost every night. And it's just. It's a peace of mind thing for me. Like. I don't. I'm not like. Hardcore privacy freak. Like if I was. I wouldn't use things like Gmail. And things like that. But like. There's things. Little things you can do. To give you peace of mind. Yes. Like. You know. Using a password database. Or using a VPN. Like ExpressVPN. Where I just. Practically had it on my entire trip. Because I'm going from hotel to hotel. Wi-Fi. Just constantly. Constantly. And I just. Like. Leave it on. And it doesn't affect anything on my phone. And it just keeps me. Keeps. You know. My IP address hidden. And like. I'm good to go. Easy peasy.

Myke Hurley: Nice and breezy. Protect your own activity today. And find out how you can get. Three months for free. At ExpressVPN.com. Slash. Penaddict. That is. E-X-P-R-E-S-S-V-P-N.com. Slash. Penaddict. For three months free of a one year package. Take back your online privacy. ExpressVPN.com. Slash. Thanks to ExpressVPN. For their support. This show. And Relay FM.

Brad Dowdy: All right. We got some good questions this week. I guess we always do. Ask TPA. Slash. The good questions edition. It's pretty much every week. So this first one's from Antonio. And he just finished listening to the episode. Where we were talking about being overwhelmed. By the number of fountain pens. That you have inked up. And that you decided to wash all of them. And start from scratch. This was something that I did. I don't know. A month or so ago. Probably sometime after the Raleigh pen show. When I was just cleaning things up. Although my soul hurts. Just imagining how much ink went down the drain. I must say that I completely understand your situation. And that I won't be surprised. When the sea turns a nice bright apricot orange color. As always with these addictions. The solution doesn't lie within the addict. But in additional purchases. I think that a cigar humidor. Might be the perfect thing for you. It would keep the air nice and moist. So that the nibs of your 75 inked up pens. Don't dry up. And the pens organized and out of sight. This way the issue is tucked away at one part of the room. And only causes anxiety. When you open the humidor. So I brought this up. To ask our listeners. Does anyone use a humidor. To store their fountain pens? No one has ever told me that they do. But the idea. Of a humidor. Has come up several times over the years. But I don't know. That anyone has. Put it into practical use. Like I'm not a cigar person. So I don't happen to have a humidor handy. To test these things out. It makes sense. I think logically. Like it would keep. You know. The pens from drying out. Or you know. Maybe the. Keep the ink from evaporating. I don't know totally how. It would. It would work. But that's something I wanted to bring up. Not as much. As a question from Antonio. But it's a question from me. To the listeners. Does anyone use a humidor. To store fountain pens? So I would like to hear from you. If you don't. Antonio. Has several other things to add. Which he went from zero. To 360 episodes. Listened in less than four months. Which is pretty amazing. He's also one of our. Croatian listeners. Which. We appreciate that. And he also wanted to remind me. That the scribble pen. Is still available for pre-order. For just $99. With only one day left to order. Myke. What a deal. What a deal. Everyone should get on that. Scribble pen deal. And you know. There's only one day left to order. For the next 365 days. At least. And yeah. It'll be a good deal. So yeah. Let me know. Let me know about your humidors. If anyone uses that. That's come up. Multiple. Cigars. Have come up multiple times. In this show. Because they also make a. Make some like sealable. Small cases. Like people were talking about. Airline travel. With fountain pens. And they would make. They'd have these cigar. Cases. That would travel very well. That people would store their fountain pens in. So. It's kind of like. The right shape and size. To. For fountain pen storage. So it keeps coming up. So let me know. Next one. It's from Patrick. And I really like this question. Myke. And it's a long one. So bear with me. So he had a question. For me and you. For STPA. He just graduated from. University. And landed his first big boy job. Says this is third week on the job. And just got my notebook situation stabilized. I like how this is going already. Like. Three weeks on the new big boy job. And he's mostly concerned about getting his notebook situation stabilized. Patrick. You are my people. Like. This is it. This is why I put this here. So let's go through his notebooks real quick. Because he has a question. For both of us. So he uses. The Rhodia Heritage sewn spine notebook. For his meeting notes. Only meeting notes. And he likes the Rhodia paper quality. And it lays flat. And the design. Doesn't break the boardroom. Boring. Aesthetic. So he's not. You know. Getting called out. But he does feel like he's giving. A small little middle finger. To conformity. Every time I walk in the boardroom. With this special notebook. Number two. Rhodia number 16. Top. Wirebound notebook. Orange. This is my to-do list. It stays on my desk at all times. After meetings. My actionable items. Go from the Rhodia heritage. To this. It's small. It sits conveniently. Next to my computer. This is why I'm such a top bound notebook fan. For desk use. So perfect. Number three. Claire Fontaine. Eight and a half by eleven. Spiral bound notebook. This is my kitchen sink notebook. Any ideas that need to work. Be worked out. Go here. It's sloppy. Messy. And organized. But that's what it's for. And I love it. So yeah. About the question. I promised. If you and Myke. God forbid. Were forced. Kicking and screaming. Back into corporate life. What would your setup be? Brad. This assumes. You don't get the privilege. To play with all the stationery. You do now. You have to pick one system. So. Can we. Think. Think. Think. About. Putting ourselves back. In the cubicle forearms. That we were once a part of. And. Think about. What notebooks. We would use. For that situation. So like. If you were going back. To an office job today. What would you bring. With you. To write on.

Myke Hurley: Um. I'll probably go back. To field notes. Mm-hmm. I always really enjoyed. Using them. They're easy.

Brad Dowdy: I remember you talking about that. And I always question. The size. About that. Like. Can you. That would work for you. In like. A day to day. I just need to write. My things down. And stop me from taking.

Myke Hurley: Too many notes. Sure. Because when I have a bigger notebook. I take too many notes.

Brad Dowdy: Yeah. That's fair. Um. My go-to. Would probably actually. Be number two. On this list. Or something similar. Anything. With a durable cover. Top bound. Preferably spiral. And perforated. So I can tear things out. And share notes. And has good quality paper. The Rhodia Ice Pad. Is like my favorite. A5 size Rhodia. Um. And they still make them. Thankfully. It's the white cover. With the gray grid. I love those. Uh. Second would probably. Be this orange or black. Um. Covered dot grid. A5. Top bound books. Are. My jam for desks. That's why we made. The red one. We make for knock. Right. That was one of the first products. We ever made. Because that's the thing. That I want to use. It's the right size. Without being too big. Or too small. It's portable. You can throw it in a bag. Leave it on a desk. You can have multiple of them. Without like. Overwhelming yourself. So. Um. Yeah. I would totally pick. A5. Top bound. Something. And it's probably rhodia. In my former job. I used. That. Plus. The large. Done paper. Um. Idea journal. Is that what the big. The big boys called? It's like the eight and a half. Eleven. Heavy. Heavy chipboard cover. Because I could carry it around. And. Use it to. You know. Do different drawings. And different tasks. That I needed to do. It was a good. Organizational notebook too. So. But if I was forced. To just pick one thing. It would be. Rhodia. A5. Top bound. Would be. Would be the jam. Because we assumed. That I hadn't created. Knock by this point. And wouldn't be using. My own notebooks.

Listener Question

Brad Dowdy: All right. Ed has a great question here. That I also wanted to bring. Up to the listeners. Says. Hello. I've been attending. The Raleigh Pen Show. For the last couple of years. And it's the only. Pen Show I've been to. I have a question. Most vendors. Don't seem to post prices. Or even a range. Of prices. For a tray. I don't like to ask about a pen. Have the vendors. Start talking it up. And then find out. It's massively. Out of my budget. Why don't vendors. Usually post prices. Is it a haggling situation. Or a presumed level of knowledge. Or something else. I lean towards. Something else. And that something else. Is just.

Brad Dowdy: It's a cross between. Laziness. And know-it-all-ism. I don't think. It's a haggling situation. I don't think. They're going into it. Saying. I'm not going to put a price on this. Because. I can get $150. From this person. And $200. From that person. I genuinely. Don't think that's it. Presumed level of knowledge. Might be. A little bit of it. But honestly. I think. For vendors. Who don't price it. They just don't care. They're doing this as a hobby. It's not their full-time business. People. That it is. Their full-time business. Generally. Do have it priced. You know. I don't know. I don't know that I have a super clear. Answer for that. But I feel like. It's more of. I just don't care. If someone wants it. They know what it's worth. Kind of like a. I don't know. I don't know if it's. I don't know. I think it's more just. Laziness. And kind of not caring. About it. As much. Because they're not. Taking it. As seriously. As someone who's. Like. Necessarily. Like. Making a living. From doing this. Right. And making it easier. For the consumer. They're not looking at it that way. They're looking at it. Hey. I'm going to show. All my pens. To all my friends. And then maybe. I'll sell some. To someone. Who kind of. Maybe knows what it is. And then we can talk about price. Um. You know. And I generally. You know. Since I'm not. Always shopping for vintage. Like. I'll just glance at the table. And if anything catches my eye. You know. I'll tend to move on. Like. I'm probably kind of like Ed. Like. If I see a table full of pens. Not priced. I'm probably not going to shop there. Because I need. Just kind of that. I need that bit of information. When I'm having those discussions. In my head. About. Do I want this? Do I want that? And that's just one more. Hurdle. I have to overcome. In the buying process. And. If the person's not going to make it easy for me. Well. There's. Other. Opportunities. Throughout the show. For. For that to happen. So. You know. I don't think it's any. Like. Conspiracy. Or. Trying to. Get a better price. From. From. A certain person. I just think it's just. That. It's a non-issue. To that person. And they're not. In it. For the same reason. Other people are. Yep. Yeah. And. If anyone else. Has any. Specific ideas. Let me know. Because I know. I know a lot of you. You know. Have some more experience. Especially on the vintage side of things. Modern pens. I would hope. All modern type stuff. Is priced. Because you have a. Competition there. And you're probably selling it. To make it living. And so. Those will be. Accurately priced. Yep. All right. Bill.

Brad Dowdy: Says. And. This comes up a lot. And I don't have a good answer. Which is probably why. I had this in the show notes. He says. A pen pal is thinking of getting. His first nib ground. The catch is. That he lives in Germany. Would you. Could you. Please. Suggest. Some nib grinders in Europe. Hopefully. Ones that travel to shows. I have a hard time. Coming up with non-US ones. I do too. Like. I put in. Some time. Searching. And. I came up with. Almost nothing. There. So. John Twist. Who's a pen maker. In the UK. I thought. Well let me go to him. And see what he does. And what he offers. And. He doesn't do the work himself. He outsources it. To a friend. There's a gentleman. By the name. And. I apologize. Just if I get this wrong. Because I forgot to write it down. But I think it's a John Soroka. And. I'll see if I can find him. But he doesn't. Publicize his services. He shows up at pen shows. And at the Dutch pen show. I think Drees. Went. From the pencil case blog. Or someone else went. And he asked not to have his picture taken. So. It's like. He's the guy that. Everyone uses. But you can't. Get a hold of him. To do the work. So. I'm grasping for straws. To help Bill out. And. You know. He. I just couldn't find an easy answer. But there has to be. There's so many. You know what? I should email Sarge. The one man pen show. And get some information from him. He would know. He knows everybody. And he's in. He's in the UK. And he probably knows people. All throughout Europe. Who could do this work. It was just not easy. For me to find. So. If anyone has any information. I would be happy. To take it. And pass it on to Bill. Because I think it's a great question. That's such a huge market. There has to be. Opportunities. And options. For. Fountain pen users. In. At least in the Western Europe. Side of things. To get nib work done. It's got to be easy. So. Y'all help me out here. With this one. But. Yeah. I found that. Super interesting. How difficult it was. For me. To help Bill out here.

Brad Dowdy: All right. Last one. From our good friend. And.

Dot Grid Advice

Brad Dowdy: Spectacularly. Quaffed. Brian Hamilton. Do you have any. I love Brian. Do you have any advice. For writing text. On dot grid paper. Writing on one row. Is too small for me. But two rows. Feels way too big. Brian is speaking. My language here.

Myke Hurley: Just. Live free Brian.

Brad Dowdy: Live free like me.

Brad Dowdy: So Brian. You can get. Different. Varying. Line widths. But I know that's hard. You got to put in the research. Just to decide. Okay. Do I need. Four millimeters. Small. Five millimeters. Width is standard. And six or greater. Is wide. Maybe you need. A six or greater. To have. The right. Spacing. For your handwriting. You could customize it. At blank slate paper. Our good friend Dave. Will send a link. I don't think I sent that link. To Brian. I may not have answered him. Already on Twitter. But I like this question. Because this is something. I fight with. From time to time. And what I'll do. Is. I'll. Try to write on one line. But I don't force myself. Into it. So sometimes. I'll go taller. Like if I have one line. And I'm writing on. I'll use. I'll. Skip a line. Because I know. I'm going to. Like roll into that. Above space. On. You know. Like an L. Or a T. Or something like that. And. It makes it a little bit. Easier to read. So. And that's on like. Standard five. Five millimeter. Width dots. I mean. I usually stay in between the line. Like I think. The reticle grid. That I just used. For the field notes. I'll have to pull it back out. And see what their spacing is. It looks like five millimeters. And I used a point five gel ink pen. And I stayed. I used one line. I didn't skip any lines. And it fit. So. Depending on your handwriting style. You can find some wider. Grids. But. That's. Kind of. You know. Like Myke said. You just kind of got to go with it. Sometimes it's okay to just skip a line. When it gets really really tight in there. I would not force yourself to write in that line. Because then it just gets messy. And. Too tight. And illegible. After you're done with it. So.

Brad Dowdy: That's what I got.

Brad Dowdy: All right.

Myke Hurley: Is that it for today?

Brad Dowdy: That is it for today buddy. You need to go rest your voice.

Myke Hurley: I apologize to everybody. That I sound this way. This is not.

Brad Dowdy: A pleasure.

Myke Hurley: For you. So I apologize.

Brad Dowdy: You took what. You took one for the team today. I appreciate it. You want to do the wrap up? Yeah. You can find. Myke. At iMike. On Twitter. All of his podcasts. Are on Relay.fm. Including this one. Relay.fm. Forward slash. Pen Addict. This will be episode number 368. You can find all the links. The show notes. Our advertisers. On there. Who do. An amazing job. Helping us. Produce this show. And supporting us. So we hope you support them too. My name is Brad. You can find me at penaddict.com. I'm on Twitter. At dowdyism. D-O-W-D-Y-I-S-M. And I'm on Instagram. And Twitch. At penaddict. So. Until next week. Say goodbye Myke. Goodbye Myke. Goodbye Myke.