The Pen Addict 683/transcript

• From Relay, this is The Pen Addict, episode number 683.
• Today's show is brought to you by Squarespace, Enigma Stationery, and Factor.
• My name is Brad Dowdy and today I'm joined by the wonderful, best recurring guest ever, Anna Reinhardt.
• How's it going, Anna?
• Just fine.
• How are you doing?
• I'm very good.
• I'm very good.
• This time, it's only, I say only in air quotes, it's only been 40 episodes since we've talked.
• So like less than a year, like last time it was like really extreme.
• Yeah, it was really extreme.
• I was starting to feel hurt, like you didn't want me anymore.
• You called me out actually, like let's just be honest.
• You're like, hey, hey you, podcast guy.
• What's up?
• Where's the love?
• And I was like, you know, I think it would be kind of perfect timing.
• I guess this was around DC, Pen Show this year.
• I was like, you know, you're going to San Fran and I know we're both going to be busy up through then.
• So let's get through that show, have you on and instead of doing our gift guide, which we might do later in the year, let's talk about pen shows.
• Let's talk about what Anna's up to.
• And like we, you know, a lot of times when we do the gift guide episode, we're just doing that stuff.
• We don't get to like talk about other stuff.
• So it's great to have you on.
• I appreciate you finding time to do this.
• Absolutely.
• It's always fun to, it's always fun to do a podcast where someone else has to do the editing.
• I know, I know.
• Right.
• And I'm actually like two thumbs up on that.
• When I do the show without Myke, I get to pass the buck on the editing.
• So, so yeah, I know.
• So you're giving me a dirty look because you edit your own podcast, which you have for Patreon members, which we're going to talk, we're going to talk a lot about that actually here in a little bit.
• Sounds good.
• But yes, sorry, sorry to you.
• I am going to pass this one off.
• Hey, if I could, I would.
• So I kind of want to start with you and the well-appointed desk and the things that have changed for you probably since we last talked about starting to work for yourself in, you know, the stationary world you've had.
• And, you know, you were at Hallmark forever, like all the years we've talked, you were at Hallmark a lot of times and then you've had a couple of jobs since then.
• But at some point in the, has it just been in the last year?
• Little over a year.
• Little over a year.
• You started to work for yourself and I just kind of want to talk about that.
• And let me know how it's going and how scary it's been and how scary it is and how awesome it is too at the same time, right?

• Well, the funny thing was like you sent me the sort of notes about what we were going to talk about and I was like, so how's it going?
• And I'm like, it's scary.
• That's my initial thought.
• It's, I mean, you know, I mean the advantage of a full-time job is that you sort of know every week that you are going to have work to do and you are going to get paid at the end of the week and you have a rough idea of what that's going to be.
• And when you work for yourself, it is a crapshoot every single week.
• So, you know, I mean, I think I've heard a lot of people talk about like when you do go into business for yourself, one of the most important things to do is to diversify how you are getting income.
• So, I know that you diversify with your subscription service and your Twitch and, you know, advertisers on the podcast and this kind of thing that all help to sort of, you know, dollars here and there.
• You also have all of the things that you do with your pen making and your shop and those kinds of things.
• But it's like I think that the only way to really pull off sort of a do-it-yourself business really is to have as many different channels for income as possible because you never know.
• One week something might really weird might happen and you have 10 subscribers all decide that they're going to cancel that week for whatever reason.
• You know, and then all of a sudden you're out, not a huge amount of money, but like a little bit.
• So, like all of a sudden you're having to find somewhere else to sort of pick up that income that you thought you were going to have.
• You know, and then one week you have a bunch of sales on your shop and then the next week it's a bit like crickets and you're like, I don't understand what happened.
• Like it was going really well and this week nothing, you know.
• So, I also have been maintaining a little bit of freelance design work for some local companies that just kind of help fill in the gaps a little bit for when those things kind of fluctuate.
• Yeah, like that's exactly right.
• Like in our business, like in the stationary world, we're not, you know, the companies we work with are not like big companies.
• They're not flush with cash.
• They're small businesses like we are.
• You know, we're not, you know, sponsored by like, you know, Nikon like camera companies or car companies or things like that.
• That's not the type of income that we see as people like who do this for like on an advertising basis, let's say.
• Which are a couple of pieces of my pie.
• But yeah, I always say there's no one thing I do that could allow me to do what I do for a living.
• Like it's like literally like you listed off like five, six, seven things and it's all a little bit here, a little bit there.
• And at the end of the year, I make it work.
• And, you know, if you lose a little bit of that, it's like, oh, yeah, that's a huge chunk.
• Yeah, it's, you know, and it's surprising.
• So like last week I did a sale on my shop for patrons and for readers of the blog.
• And so they got a little, you know, discount and that sort of bumped my sales up a bit more than I normally have, which was really nice.
• You know, which balanced out, you know, some expenditures that I had on the other end and, you know, just different things like that.
• So it's, you just never know.
• And one of the huge things is like learning how to promote the business where it doesn't feel like I'm inundating people with advertising and like, please buy my stuff, please buy my stuff.
• Because that's not what I want.
• That's I don't want to run my business that way.
• Like I want people to want to buy it, not feel obligated to buy it because I whine.
• Right, right.
• Yeah, it's a balance.
• It's and it's tough and it's not easy.
• You know, like I'm not going to this is no pity party either.
• Like I have fun doing this.
• We're in an awesome hobby.
• We have great, great customers.
• We have great friends.
• We've been doing both been doing this a long time.
• And it's great to have these support systems built in and just a wonderful community to help us do this.
• So I'm wondering, have you had like any like real surprises like over the first year or something like super challenging?
• Was there any like point of regret or point of like, heck, yes, we're doing this or all the things like I know it's tough.
• It is tough.
• So initially I was going to say like the big thing for me is I'm I'm really bad at like remembering to do things like post on Instagram that I have a new product or send a newsletter to subscribers of the shop.
• You know, those types of things.
• But actually the biggest struggle that I've had is that I started doing a sticker business part, you know, sticker component to my business where I'm doing different themed sheets of stickers.
• And I started that whole thing like it is all done right here in this room, which Brad can see.
• But I mean, like I was printing them.
• I was cutting them myself, all that kind of stuff.
• And it has gotten to where I cannot do that and continue to create new products.
• So just this week, I've reached out to a local printer and hopefully he's sending me samples this week.
• So hopefully I will have better quality, larger volume, you know, opportunities with the stickers.
• And then I can design them and send them to them and they can print and kiss cut all of them.
• So like the hardest thing was like I was using like home Cricut machines to cut stickers and one sheet will cut beautifully and the next sheet will cut too deep and then the next sheet won't cut at all.
• And I've not changed anything.
• You know, it's just like they're not designed to do the kind of scale and the kind of fine work that I need done.
• And so like it was time to admit that like I need to invest in a full – and so like when I contacted the printer and I'm like, I have 49 different designs already.
• And I'm like, and I need to like get – I need to get quantities up and the whole thing.
• And he's like, we're in.
• What do you need?
• So – and I'm really excited.
• They're a local business.
• They're just about like 30 or 40 minutes south of me.
• So I think they're really excited to like work with me and know that they're going to get like consistent work from me and stuff.
• So that's pretty exciting.
• But also way stressful.
• Oh, for sure.
• And that's like literally one little thing that's like taken up so much like brain power and just work to try to get it done.
• But it's something cool that like you – like any of us doing this on our own, like you personally had to figure this out.
• You're like, okay, I'm really good at this, you know, part of design.

• I really want to make these stickers.
• And, you know, a lot of things – and we can talk about it – you know, a lot of things that you and I make, we make because we already enjoy these things, right?
• Like so you have the ability and the passion to put behind like this sticker project.
• And you're like, heck yeah, let's go for it.
• And you're like get to a point that's like, oh, no.
• Let's maybe reboot, rethink this.
• And it's all these little explorations that we have to have as we start to build things.
• I think it's kind of comparable to when you guys were doing Knock, like when you were doing it in-house and just once you hit a volume where it was just like we're not a big enough shop to do this by ourselves.
• We really need to bring in someone from the outside who has the, you know, the capabilities and just sort of like moving that – sort of moving the production out of house.
• Yeah, yeah, exactly.
• So in like this first year, what has been, you know, your – what's been kind of your goal this year as far as not like, you know, maybe like black and white goals but like growing the shop?
• Like have you made like enough products, you know, for – Oh, gosh, no.
• That you've been happy with?
• Okay.
• Like have you done – have you taught enough at pen shows?
• Like all the things – Oh, that's way too much of that.
• I know.
• Yeah.
• So it's like what do you – what do you – what is your week or month look like right now as far as like the things you're doing and are you kind of like happy with that or are you like trying to do some different things?
• You know, I think part of it is figuring out like every month is a – is another opportunity for me to figure out how to do things better, how to try to schedule things better because it – like you, like I'm – you know, I'm doing audio.
• I'm doing video.
• I'm doing social media.
• I'm doing blog posts.
• And it's like making sure that I allot the appropriate amount of time for each task where I'm not spending an inordinate amount of time on something that most people either don't see or don't realize took eight hours to accomplish, you know.
• And it's just – so part of it is just figuring out best use of time and make – you know, and again, we've talked about it before.
• This is – we do this because we love it.
• And like I go back every time I make something and it's like if this is not something I want to use, I am not going to sell it.
• Like it – Right.
• Like because people are always like, oh, well, you could do this or you could do that.
• And I'm like, I don't like that kind of thing, you know, like whatever it is.
• And it's like it's not that I want to exclude anyone from the joy, but like it needs to – it needs to be something that I stand behind.
• And I think you have that same perspective of like making sure that you don't ever go like, well, this is what people are asking for, you know.
• Right.
• It's like meh.
• Yeah.
• There's only X we can do, right?
• And so we're always going to start – and not to put words in your mouth.
• I'm only going to start with like the things I like super believe in and super passionate about.
• And like being a one-person show, it rarely gets past that.
• It rarely gets past that, those few things that I'm like super interested in, right, just because there's not enough time.
• Right.
• And you're not going to work on the thing where you're like you're half-hearted about – Right.
• Again, putting words in your mouth this time, but like I don't want to work on something that I feel half-hearted about.
• Yeah.
• It's just never going to get done or I'm never going to be happy with it.
• So like I had a sticker sheet that I kept noodling with and noodling with to try to get it.
• And I'm like I think the problem is that I thought I was going to like this artwork.
• Like I purchased artwork from a stock illustration house and it just in the end was like not working for me.
• And I'm like you know what?
• I just need to cut my losses on this one and do something different.
• Like this is not working for me.
• Super hard to do.
• Yeah, it is.
• It's hard to let go of that kind of thing because once you've put in all that time, you're like oh I should just do it.
• I should just do it.
• And I'm like I don't want to.
• I don't like it.
• Has there been anything on the list that you said I'm totally going to do this once I start you know being my own boss and has just never come back up again?
• Has there been that thing that's just like oh man I'm totally doing this and like there's just no shot now that you're actually doing it and reality hits?
• I think the one the thing that's come up most frequently is because I work from home now and I kind of get to set my own schedule.
• I was so confident that every day I was going to go for a walk at lunch or like mid afternoon because no one controls my schedule.
• So if I want to go for a walk for half an hour at two o'clock nobody's going to stop me except for me because I'm a boss.
• Oh pardon my French who insists that my behind be in the chair working no matter what.
• And I'm like but the whole point of working for myself was like I wanted to do things like walk around my neighborhood or go to the library or like and most of the time if I go out it's like I fit 17 errands into 30 minutes and I come home completely shredded because I haven't seen humans in a month.
• Yeah exactly.
• There's my wife will rarely you know get on me about anything like my desk is a catastrophe.
• I got stuff everywhere.
• I know that bothers her but she doesn't say anything because she knows something going on.
• You know I'm doing something shifting around whatever I pick up today is going to be right back tomorrow.
• The one thing she will get on me is you need to go outside.
• You need to go for a walk.
• Touch grass.
• Yeah you need to touch grass.
• I'm like yes you're right.
• So that's that's something that doesn't get easier apparently.
• No.
• Because I'm terrible at it.
• I'm super super bad at it.
• I do have a friend who lives about seven blocks away and she also works from home and so occasionally about five o'clock she'll she'll send me a text message and she's like go for a walk.
• And so sometimes she'll get me to stop working at least by five.
• Yeah.
• To be like meet me at the corner.
• We'll walk for a while.
• So yeah.
• Yeah.
• So so take care of yourself people like make time for yourself.
• Yeah.
• I had to start wearing my Apple watch around the house because I wouldn't stand up and I had to make it yell at me.
• I hate that thing yelling at me to stand up now and I was like you know what I know I just have to do it because I'll just sit here for hours doing whatever I'm doing and forget like it just just working.
• So all right.
• I want to talk a little bit about your Patreon but first let me talk about our first sponsor today which is our good friends over at Squarespace.
• So this episode of the Panic is brought to you by Squarespace.
• Squarespace is the all-in-one website platform designed to help you stand out and succeed online.
• Whether you're just starting out or scaling your business Squarespace gives you everything you need to claim your domain showcase your offering offerings with a professional website.
• Grow your brand and get paid all in one place.
• So I've been using Squarespace for what seems like a decade but a decade plus gosh I can't even imagine how long I've been using.
• I got to see if I can figure that out somehow but they make it easy for me to write my blog and to have a shop and put products on there and have sales and collect it and connect it to shipping platforms.
• And kind of have an all-in-one platform for me to use for my job.
• And one of the easy things that Squarespace has built in that I don't have to deal with is their fast and integrated SEO tools.
• So nobody wants to build a beautiful website only for zero people to see it.
• That's why every Squarespace website is optimized to be indexed with meta descriptions and auto-generated sitemap and more.
• So more people find your site through search engine results.
• I literally just kind of tag my images with whatever product name that is and just let it go.
• And it seems to get out there, get out in the world, people come find the site and it makes me happy.
• They also allow what I mentioned before to offer your services and get paid.
• I have a shop on Squarespace but you can do anything from consultations and events and experiences and you can showcase those offerings with a customizable website designed to attract clients.
• And grow your business.
• So think about built-in appointment scheduling or email marketing tools and more.
• Plus, keep everything cohesive with on-brand invoices and get paid easily with online payments.
• So head over to squarespace.com slash penaddict for a free trial.
• And when you're ready to launch, use the offer code PENADDICT to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain.
• That's squarespace.com slash penaddict.
• Offer code PENADDICT to get 10% off your first purchase and to show your support for the penaddict.
• Our thanks to Squarespace for their support of this show and all of Relay.
• So yeah, I really do need to figure out how long I've been on Squarespace because it's been forever.
• Sure.
• So one of the things you kind of had going before going full-time was your Patreon.
• And I'm a huge supporter of people making Patreons and I support several stationary Patreons and other non-stationary Patreons and other membership services.
• So tell me how your Patreon has changed what you offer over there for people looking to help support the work you do.
• Well, as of this past year, I added the exclusive podcast where people can listen to me babble into a microphone for 40 minutes every other week.
• Yep, I have notes on that for later this episode.
• Great.
• It's only fair.
• I used to text you all the time when I listened to Pen Addict and been like, you're wrong, you're wrong.
• So it's, I mean, turnabout is fair play and all that kind of stuff.
• And then I've also added printables.
• So every month I offer like a printable calendar that can be like dropped into an existing notebook or planner.
• I do it at A5 size, A6, B6, and someone asked for weeks sizes.
• So I do those too.
• And I do like a collage illustration on the front.
• And then there's like a full, you know, just sort of like a calendar on the inside.
• And I put a bunch of stupid holiday dates in along the margin.
• So, you know, things like National Donut Day and stuff like that.
• It's an important day.
• It's an important event.
• So if you want to add them to your calendar, you can.
• And these, like the printables thing, I have thought about turning it into like a pre-printed delivered service where I mail them out and stuff.
• But people who have been subscribing for a while can tell you they usually get them like two days before the month starts.
• This goes back to the whole like scheduling and making sure that you do things in a timely manner.
• But it's something that I've thought about and am considering making, you know, offering that as a possibility for 2026.
• Where they would get like subscribers could subscribe at the, you know, whatever printable.
• Like they're not printables anymore, but like calendar level or whatever.
• And they would get the calendar and then like coordinating stickers or whatever mailed to them before the beginning of the month.
• Yeah, exactly.
• I've thought about doing like a physical good.
• And that's like, that's something that excites me like to do, to create, but intimidates me more than anything just from a scheduling perspective like you're talking about.
• Yeah, the scheduling and with, you know, the current status of the USPS, if things go out just sort of standard US mail, not like the priority or anything like that.
• Some things can take over two weeks to like seven to 10 business days to arrive.
• So you really like basically have to mail them out the first of the month prior.
• So I would definitely have to get like further ahead so that I could kind of prepare three months in advance and have them ready.
• Kind of a thing.
• So I don't know.
• So then the podcast is wonderfully named TLDR.
• So what do you share on the podcast?
• It started off as very much sort of the idea of link love, except that I basically talk you through sort of things that are going on.
• And I break it up in the same way that I do link love, which is posted on the blog on Wednesdays.
• And then podcasts are every other Thursday.
• And so I talk about like, what's new in pens?
• What's new in ink?
• What's new, you know?
• And rather than using any of the content from link love, it's sort of, I go through every newsletter I get, every website I visit and whatever's going on in the business.
• And then I usually have some sort of main topic where I'll babble for 10 minutes about something randomly.
• Yeah.
• So that's me setting you up to get into our next topic if you're ready.
• I'm ready.
• Because this week's podcast was, the intro was basically talking about the San Francisco Pen Show, which you had just been to.
• And that's kind of what we had talked about, talking about this week, because I think you and I are very fortunate in that we've got to go to a lot of pen shows.
• And like, sometimes they're like the best thing ever.
• They usually are.
• And then sometimes they're tough.
• And it's always interesting to try to like decipher why.
• And I really just wanted to kind of get your feedback first on San Francisco.
• Number one, have you recovered?
• Because after listening to your podcast, it's been what, you've been home for 10, 11 days now.
• I still don't know how you're recovered.
• And honestly, it's because it's so close in terms of time to the DC show.
• So there's really only like three weeks, you know, and that's including like the first day of the week that you travel, usually travel home.
• So it's like two and a half-ish weeks of recovery between DC and San Francisco.
• So I think some of it is that by the time I get to San Francisco, I have been basically on a dead run for like six weeks.
• I think when I, you know, when I like when I got home, you know, my husband asked me like, what do you want to do this weekend?
• And I'm like, absolutely nothing.
• I have done something every weekend for like six weeks.
• I'm like, I want nothing.
• It's jammy day every day for two straight days.
• We're ordering takeout.
• I'm not cooking.
• I'm not cleaning.
• Nothing.
• Done.
• But yeah, so San Francisco.
• And it's interesting because DC is usually the show that tends to stress me out or wear me out more because it is so crowded.
• It's usually very hot in DC that weekend.
• And it just has, you know, it has an East Coast vibe.
• People tend to be a little bit more intense on the East Coast.
• There's a little more, you know.
• Yeah.
• There's a high level.
• High level.
• Yeah.
• Yeah.
• I mean, everybody's like high intensity, that kind of thing.
• But this year, for some reason, San Francisco was super crowded.
• It does not fit in its space anymore, I think.
• Yeah.
• My humble opinion.
• Sure.
• Someone might disagree.
• But I know that I talked with a lot of people who were attendees who were like, Friday was crazy, like what most shows are on Saturday.
• And then Saturday was so busy and so crowded, like you could not get through the aisles.
• I'm thinking back to like when we were in the back corner in DC, like that level of crowded.
• Yeah.
• That's how it felt in San Francisco this year.
• Like it got so bad.
• I was working for the Van Ness pen shop table.
• And we were in the back ballroom in the hallway where the, so like there was a ballroom on the left along where all the nib grinders were.
• So if you need to use the restroom or get a beverage or something like that, there was no way to part the seas of crowds to get there.
• So we started going out the fire exit, going outside and around the building and coming back in, just in order to like not take 45 minutes or an hour to just get to the restroom and back.
• Like it was that level of crazy.
• And so that was very stressful.
• I also, I taught too many classes.
• Like let's be honest here.
• I taught four classes and two workshops.
• I did one every day, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, and Sunday.
• Saturday, Saturday, I had three, I think.
• I had like a seminar and two classes.
• And one of my classes was at seven o'clock at night.
• Yeah.
• I was basically, I worked for like 12 or 14 hours.
• So I was just like exhausted.
• I hope that people had a good time.
• They seem to have a good time.
• Like lots of people came and told me they really enjoyed the classes.
• But yeah, because I was also working.
• I think if I was just teaching and then could have like gone back to my room for an hour and rested after each class, it might not have been as bad.
• But again, this goes back to that whole like, I got to do a lot of different things to make this work out financially for me.
• Because flying from Kansas City to San Francisco and the hotel and food and everything is quite expensive.
• And, you know, when it's one of many shows that I intend, like I just have to balance all of that.
• Yeah.
• So specifically this show, they did something a little bit different this year.
• And you mentioned it just a second ago.
• They kind of had a Thursday night kickoff.
• It was all day Thursday.
• Was it all day Thursday?
• I didn't realize that.
• So that puts you out even more.
• You're there even more.
• Yes.
• So how do you think that went just as a concept?
• From a cost standpoint for people who are staying at the hotel, it does add additional cost.
• However, Thursday was my favorite day.
• Yeah.
• That's kind of what I grasped from your podcast.
• Yeah.
• And we flew in on Wednesday evening.
• So we were able to, like, get up on Thursday morning, not have to set up a table, not have to do any of that.
• But, like, I went for a walk with Lisa Van Ness and Sean Newton and Daryl from Misubi.
• And we, like, walked along the waterfront for, like, an hour and just got to talk with one another, which was really nice.
• Then I got to take a class, which I never get to do.
• And I got to hang out with – the class I took was Cheryl Ball from Rickshaw is a bookbinder.
• And so she taught a bookbinding class.
• So I actually got to experience the class side, which was lovely.
• And then I taught a class.
• And then there was a – there were several other classes hosted at the same time.
• So people were kind of moving around to different events.
• But then there was also a big seminar in the evening with the Japanese – mostly Japanese, like, sort of luminaries.
• And that was really cool, too, because, again, oftentimes I don't get to attend a lot of these events.
• So it was nice to actually be able to go and participate in these kinds of things.
• And it does make me think that attending classes and workshops and things like that are what are going to make a lot of these large events more pleasurable, more fun for people.
• Because it does give you a chance to, one, sit down for a little while, get to experience and actually use things, use tools, whatever, whether it's pens, whether it's ink, whether it's, you know, different kinds of paper or notebooks or journaling techniques.
• And I think that, you know, with everything that's going on in the world, focusing more on how we can utilize our tools and new ways to do it and new, you know, new tools to use, I think is going to be really exciting for people as the potential exists that maybe it's going to be more challenging or more expensive to, you know, get pens in from Europe and that kind of thing.
• So, but I really enjoyed that.
• And I think it's also one of the things that made like the Chicago Planner Convention last year so appealing for a lot of people is that it's much more focused on the classes and the workshops and, you know, big events with like the whole group kind of doing like a keynote address where they bring in a speaker and that kind of thing.
• So it's more activity based than shopping based.
• Yeah.
• Yeah.
• So I'm glad you mentioned that because I came to that realization for myself and I'm just speaking from a personal note that now that I'm not working pen shows per se, like for a table or for a vendor, that I can only walk around the show so much without just getting exhausted or even bored.
• Or broke.
• Yeah, or broke.
• Yeah, for sure.
• For sure.
• So, like at DC, I did three classes.
• That's the most I've ever done.
• And I think in the future, that might be my low bar.
• It's like I just want to go hang out with friends.
• I have enough time to go see everyone and see all the marketplaces and see the vendors and see all the products.
• But I don't need to do that for three days in a row or two days in a row, however long I'm there.
• But what I get the most personal joy from or the most personal, like that helps me personally the most is sitting in class, learning from someone, getting taught.
• You know, I've been in your classes.
• I took your sigils class at the California show earlier this year.
• It was fantastic.
• I wouldn't shut up about it to everyone who would ask.
• And, you know, going to DC, getting to sit in three classes where I got to draw or sling ink or whatever, that made my show.
• Like I had the best time in DC, but it's because I chose or made myself do things a little bit differently.
• Because like you're saying, this is how I see the progression of these shows going.
• Eventually, there will always be a marketplace aspect.
• But especially for someone like you and I, even if you weren't working, going to a show has to be more than just the buying and selling piece.
• Right.
• If we're going more for than like Saturday afternoon.
• Right.
• If we're going to be there for two days, well, I need to enrich myself, not just deplete my wallet while I'm there.
• Right.
• And I think it's important for people who attend more than one show a year because most of the vendors are very similar from show to show.
• So if you go to DC and San Francisco, there are a few differences, but not so many to make it worthwhile to spend three days doing nothing but shop.
• Yeah.
• So, you know, I mean, the experience, and, you know, this goes back to, you know, some of the events that happened at San Francisco this year included like JetPens hosted a Hobonichi preview event, which people could sign up for and get to touch and feel all of the new Hobonichi covers and look at the different formats and that kind of thing.
• So there are different kinds of events that are now being made available at these, you know, at the pen shows, at stationary events that are going to be part of or a bigger part of the draw to attend.
• Mm-hmm.
• Yeah.
• In my humble opinion.
• Yeah.
• Like San Francisco, I know last year when I was there and this year even more so, they just straight up have speakers, right?
• They just have speaking events where you come and listen to someone talk about, like I saw Tazo Yamamoto last year talk about paper, right?
• And I think you probably did that again this year than like you were talking about the other events, you know, the Japanese stationary superstars and all that type of stuff.
• Like those types of things make a big difference to people who have, you know, we're, hey, we're very fortunate to have done this dozens of times, right?
• Yeah.
• But there's only so many pens I can see in a three-day weekend.
• Let me have something else that I can learn from and I can be smarter and I can be a better stationary consumer and more knowledgeable in having these seminars and classes.
• So I want to talk specifically about your classes because you've even expanded from when I was taking your classes in earlier this year.
• But let me talk about our second sponsor.
• This episode of the Pen Attic Podcast is brought to you by Enigma Stationery.
• Enigma Stationery offers unique items made from in-house designs along with top brands and hard to find imports.
• The brand new EnigmaStationery.com website is here along with pre-orders for Enigma Ink Vent 2025.
• Each Ink Vent set includes 25 ink samples, a scratch-off sheet to reveal each day's ink name, new and improved vial labels for storage provided in a sealed envelope to avoid spoilers, an exclusive new gift item.
• The ink samples are all new selections for 2025 and for the first time, all sets will be the same to create a shared experience for all customers.
• Each set will include a mix of currently available and hard to find inks across 12 different brands.
• Enigma Ink Vent sets include your choice of eight stand colors and if you don't need a stand, they will swap it for a mystery item.
• The price of the Enigma Ink Vent set is $140 including shipping and this is to U.S.
• addresses only and only 50 sets are going to be made.
• Pre-orders will be open until October 17th or while supplies last.
• Sets have sold out for the last three years so don't delay.
• Pre-orders will ship in early November and arrive before December 1st.
• So head over to EnigmaStationery.com.
• Check out all they have to offer.
• And they also have a code PENADDIC25 at checkout to receive a free gift and free shipping on orders of $50 or more.
• So check that out.
• And our thanks to this week's sponsor, Enigma Stationery.
• So go check them out, EnigmaStationery.com.
• So what classes are you cooking on these days?
• I keep seeing a new class pop up here and there.
• Like I said, I took the...
• Which class did I take?
• Sigils.
• The sigils.
• I was going to call it glyphs.
• The sigils.
• Yeah.
• That was the class that I taught in San Francisco and in D.C.
• in the evenings.
• And for D.C., Lisa, Olive Octopus, was kind enough to bring candles for me.
• So we got to have like a whole like chill out vibe.
• That's the way to do it.
• Anything involving fire is really hard when I fly.
• So for San Francisco, we didn't have candles, but we did.
• It was in the evening.
• And I think people really enjoyed like just being able to chill out.
• So it is honestly sigils I will always in the future teach in the evenings because I think that's a really good fit.
• People can kind of get a chance to relax.
• There was one like in my class in San Francisco, there was one person who was like it was still too much stimulus.
• And they were like, you know what?
• I'm going to go back to my room and work.
• She's like, I really want to work on this.
• But like there's just too much going on in here because it was it was a bigger class.
• But we had a really good time.
• And people like made friends with everybody at their table.
• So like they were they just didn't want to leave.
• So like after the class was over, like people just wanted to chit chat and hang out, which I freaking love.
• I was so like it means so much to me that they were comfortable enough with the class and with each other to like make friends and hang out and just like sort of just be a part of the event.
• But I taught that class.
• I've I've been teaching the ink swatching class, which I think has run its course.
• There's enough other people now teaching different kinds of ink.
• Throw your ink around, you know, play with your inks that ink swatching might I might shut that down.
• I don't know.
• We'll see.
• We'll see.
• I did have quite a few people sign up for it.
• It's it's it tends to be more for like new to the like not beginner, but like they've been in the hobby for a year or two and they just kind of.
• The nice thing with that class is they get to try everything.
• I bring every kind of ink swatching tool possible to let everybody try them out.
• And then they also get to go home with like a little kit of things so that they can try swatching on their own.
• But I taught a on Thursday.
• I taught the carve your own rubber stamps.
• Which is done with erasers.
• And at the end of that class, I have each student take their stamp and like stamp it in other people's books if they want to like nobody's forced to do it.
• But it's ended up being like everybody's favorite part because they get to go home with like a memory of everything that everybody did in the class.
• So the person sitting next to them who's maybe their stamp turned out a thousand times better than what they thought their stamp turned out.
• So they get to take a little they get to take a version of it home with them.
• And then the same thing with like you know there's that one person whose stamp just turned out a little wonky.
• And they feel bad about it.
• But everybody looks at it and they're like I can tell what it is.
• It's super cool.
• It was your first one.
• Like we love it.
• So it's just like they're such good experiences.
• And then this in D.C.
• I test drove it and then I did it again in San Francisco which was my newest class which is gamify your life.
• Which is I'm freaking mad crazy in love with this whole concept of gamifying your planning and everything.
• And so that was super exciting.
• And everybody in the class got a player's handbook.
• Love it.
• So because I can't not design like a bunch of like nonsensical things.
• I did make a zine for the class which I'm so excited about it.
• I hope people like it as much as I do.
• But like again I feel like if I like it other people are going to like it.
• So hopefully my theory works.
• Yeah.
• But the whole like in this class the whole concept is using sort of D&D based video game based tactics to apply to sort of your everyday life.
• And then also add in using dice and sort of randomization to get tasks accomplished and things like that.
• So that was my little 30 second pitch.
• Yeah.
• No.
• I'll be signing up for that immediately.
• Actually both.
• I haven't done the carving one.
• I missed that one in DC.
• But I plan on both of those the next time we're together.
• Yeah.
• They sound amazing.
• And for Gamify for people who aren't able to actually attend a pen show I will actually sell the zine and some kits and stuff on the shop like I do with the sigils.
• Like you can just purchase a sigil zine if you're not available like not in in the continental US or you know unable to attend a show.
• You can pick up copies of the zines.
• And like I said I'm this time with the Gamify one I'm kitting it out where you'll also get a set of dice with it.
• Random selection.
• Are those are those up now on the on the site?
• The Gamify not yet.
• Literally it's because I have to go take the pictures.
• Yeah.
• I have to set up a photo shoot take pictures write the description list it like so next week.
• Get your dice out get your dice out Anna.
• Absolutely.
• Absolutely.
• So that's that that's next in in the works.
• But yeah so probably next week those will be available and they'll be available on my Etsy shop too because I don't mind shipping those internationally.
• Nice nice.
• All right.
• Let's kind of wrap up this pen show section with the impossible question and like I'm going to pose it but it's not I don't expect like clarity from either of us in this because it's it's something I think about it a lot but it's impossible to answer.
• It's like what what would you change about the pen shows that we go to or what is the perfect pen show look like and it's I caveat that whole thing with like it's really difficult to put these shows on so I don't want to put myself in anyone's shoes.
• I have chosen not to run one of these shows for my sanity despite being asked many times I know I know what I'm capable of and I could not handle that so I am not telling anyone what they should do.
• But there are challenges and you can't just say like as much as we would all say hey just move to a bigger space.
• Well let me tell you how difficult that is which you went over a little bit in the podcast.
• It's like it's not that easy.
• So let me with that out of the way I can rephrase the question now.
• What would you like to see like is there anything like like interesting like you would like to see changed or besides like the size space.
• Hey let's let's spread this out a little bit more and have perfect transportation and and great eating options everywhere.
• Like that's my perfect one is like make it easy to get to make it accessible and have have food but like you know it's not a perfect thing.
• Is there anything on your list that you think about.
• It's I mean all of the things that you expressed it's like you know that sort of like dream venue where it's like you know I I've been to other kinds of conventions you know like I always I always compare a pen show to a to like comic-con or something like that.
• And it's like those all have their flaws too.
• I've been to San Diego.
• I can tell you the problems with an event at that scale.
• But also those types of events like going back to like panels and seminars and things like that like comic-con people plan their entire you know of you know travel times and events so that they can attend certain panels because they want to hear people speak.
• They want to hear they want to hear the Q&A's they want the you know you know like how do I get into the business like those types of things.
• Like I was talking with I think it was Skogsie's wife this weekend or at San Francisco and she had mentioned that she is a bookkeeper and I'm like there needs to be bookkeeping for small makers.
• Yeah.
• Yeah.
• She's like oh totally I could do that and I'm like yes like that's the kind of thing that you'd host on a Thursday afternoon or Thursday evening at a pen show where people who are getting into the business or sort of are in the business but would love some tips about how do I do this better like how you know should I get QuickBooks online or can I keep doing it on a spreadsheet.
• You know like dumb questions like that but like adding all of those things in and we've I think we've talked about this before the idea of like you know on in the evenings or the day before having events and seminars and that kind of thing panels that are just maker related or people who want to get into the business you know and do those sort of like before the actual event where during the event there's a lot more need for pen basics.
• Pen basics and you know journaling meetups and things like that where that are sort of more generally general interest kind of things.
• But you know as we talked about earlier I think it's I think the focus is on the activities people are still going to spend money they're just going to do it faster.
• Yeah exactly right so not to like cut down like any like marketplace you know time but more activities you know like I think like I think that would probably just like narrow it down if I could narrow it down to one thing is like give me more extras like off more off floor activities because like trust me like you just said I'll just spend my money faster.
• Like like I'm gonna spend the same amount of money probably you know it's just I'm not gonna walk in circles for two days I'm gonna go enrich my my mind a little bit more and maybe learn some new things alongside of like shopping and doing those things.
• And I and I've seen that with like the Chicago planner convention the marketplace was closed during class session times.
• So it one enabled the vendors to attend or teach classes without having to sort of abandon their table but also it meant that attendees were given very clear windows because I mean it was like a package deal where you paid for two classes you know each day and and the marketplace entry and the keynote.
• So it was like instead of like paying individually for each component they had like a blanket fee for the whole thing but it also meant like so everybody took a class.
• Yeah.
• Or if they chose not to take a class they went back to their room or they went out to eat or something like that which is perfectly fine but it also meant that the you know the when there was shopping time like people were it was business they were ready to shop.
• Right right right.
• And just put it into a slightly different focus I'm not saying that that's a solution to pen shows in general but I do think that you know when you think about I go back to San Diego Comic-Con like when there was like the big Hall H panels and like 500 people when were you know all streamed off the floor so that they could go and see you know a preview of the latest Marvel movie the floors loosened up.
• And so the people who stayed like had a little bit more wiggle room.
• So yeah I think more event more off-floor events to your point would actually help traffic flow and.
• Yeah.
• Because a point you made earlier was the people new to the hobby and the beginners they need the time on the floor right.
• They need to ask questions about pens but that means they need to get to the table which sometimes they can't even do that like on a Saturday afternoon in DC or something like that.
• Like these people are here to to learn and experience their first show and learn how to fill a fountain pen or how do I hold this and they need that one-on-one with those vendors.
• So like that I don't want to discount any of that stuff because that's very important to our hobby overall is to have this continued new growth in the hobby but they'll get turned away when they can't when they can't you know ask a very basic question or handle a very simple pen or have Anna pick out their favorite ink for them.
• You know what color is sepia Anna can you help me with that.
• And like that that's important stuff for people to have access to and when you know they they see some of the overwhelm like that's that's a turnoff.
• Yeah.
• You raised an interesting idea like what if there was a room designated for beginners and every two hours or you know half of Friday half of Saturday was sponsored by one day it's sponsored by pilot one day it's sponsored by Lamy one day it's sponsored by Kaweko.
• And they have a whole tray of tester pens so people can come in and they can try out all the different nib sizes they can sit down they can see how to fill these pens.
• And you know again that gets them in a position where they can actually test them without necessarily blocking if pilot has a new release or you know something like that where more experienced collectors are like beelining to a particular table.
• You know that I mean what if they were just like Fridays pen testing you know pen sampling area sponsored by so and so or you know could even be sponsored by by a small maker who has all the yo the yo-o nibs or something like that.
• Totally.
• I think it'd be kind of fun.
• I think that's a great idea.
• To circle back to our earlier conversation my watch just told me to stand up which means we're doing a great job at the show we're just chugging right along.
• So I thought I'd point that out it just dinged me it's like hey you know sometimes you gotta stand up but you know what I'm not ready to.
• I'm ready to talk about planners for 2026 because I actually have some some particular questions that you're you're very dialed in.
• This is I feel the least dialed in I've ever been and I'm not saying that you might not be the most dialed in but you're like pretty on on the cusp.
• You're trying out some some new things but since I want to dig into this a little bit let me hit our last sponsor real quick and then we'll be free to roam where we want to because I do have questions.
• So this episode of the pen act is brought to you by factor.
• So I don't know about y'all but I fall always feels like a bit of a reset.
• I'm trying to get there.
• It's it's almost reset time to me.
• Maybe maybe once fall officially kicks off everyone's getting busier.
• Kids are going back to school and when you add in these shorter days finding time to cook can be tough.
• That's why so many people love factor their chef prepped dietitian approved meals make it easy to stay on track and enjoy something comforting and delicious.
• No matter how hectic the season gets with factor you can enjoy more variety and more meals choose from a wider selection of weekly meal options including premium seafood choices like salmon and shrimp at no extra cost and support your wellness goals to enjoy GLP one friendly meals and new Mediterranean diet options packed with protein and good for you fats.
• And you can savor these global flavors for the first time try Asian inspired meals with bold flavors influenced by China Thailand and more for more choices to better nutrition 97% of customers say that factor help them live a healthier life.
• You'll feel the difference no matter you routine.
• So my routine with factor is there always my lunch meal.
• When I'm working by myself I'm working at home a lot of times I'm the only one in the house so I don't really want to do something elaborate and I don't want to just eat the same sandwich every day.
• So factor works perfectly for me take a little break during the middle of the day pop a factor meal in the microwave for about two minutes and have a wonderful enjoyable lunch and it actually allows me to sit and chill for a little bit since I don't have to worry about prepping the meal for very long.
• I can just have a wonderful meal eat be satisfied and still rest for a little bit so that's important to me so you can eat smart at factor meals dot com slash pen addict 50 off is where you want to go use the code pen addict 50 off that's five zero off to get 50% off on your first box plus free breakfast for one year.
• That's code pen addict 50 off at factor meals dot com to get 50% off plus free breakfast for one year get delicious ready to eat meals delivered with factor offer only valid for new factor customers with code and qualifying auto renewing subscription purchase our thanks to factor and their support of the show and all of relay.
• Should we have a planner subscription service?
• I'm sure there's plenty.
• Oh, there's probably not.
• There's too many out there, but you would have to change every year, right?
• Like that's that's the fun part of planner season.
• So that's why I always laugh about planner season.
• So it's officially here, right?
• I feel like September 1st is kind of the kickoff.
• I mean the fact that Hobonichi Day is like a legit date on people's calendars.
• Yeah.
• Is proof positive.
• Yeah, I swear it wasn't too many years ago one or two years ago that like end of July I'm starting to see 2026 planners.
• I'm like chill just chill for a second.
• But like September I get it like you got a plan you got to build up you have you have dated products to sell.
• You need to get them get them out there.
• But like someone like Hobonichi who like I kind of look at as kind of like a marker of when the season starts like everything.
• Hobonichi takes a lot of oxygen out of the room and then they kind of have their minute and everyone gets all their stuff.
• And now like other stuff starts happening.
• So have you seen anything like super interesting?
• Has anything caught your eye different than this year?
• Same as last year?
• What what do you what are you kind of personally looking at?
• Because I'm kind of stuck in my ways a little bit right now, which is weird for me as far as planners go.
• Well, I mean, I could dive into the whole Hobonichi or Tomoe River paper fiasco from 2025.
• Yeah, I mean, that's a whole deal.
• It's a whole deal.
• And a lot of the there were because of the success of Hobonichi and the appeal of those books with the Tomoe River paper.
• There are a lot of smaller makers who have popped up in the last five to seven years.
• I'm I'm probably off on the dates, but they've been around for a while.
• Yeah, that sounds right.
• Some of them are super, super successful in the planner community, which is sort of adjacent to the pen community.
• But people like Sterling Inc., Wonderland 222 and Ora Estelle are probably three of the most popular that are sort of like.
• Most pen people are maybe not as familiar with those as planner people, even though essentially they're kind of the same people.
• But so each one has decided to tackle the issue with the Tomoe River paper problem from 2025 differently because they all had planners that looked very similar to some extent to Hobonichi, but maybe didn't have the little quotes at the bottom of each page and had some different page layouts for daily pages or that kind of thing.
• But Wonderland 222 picked their own paper.
• So they chose a different Japanese paper.
• They won't tell anybody what it is, but I have some pretty good guesses.
• They gave me a sample.
• Works really well.
• There are some, you know, some things will bleed or show through in the same way that with Tomoe River that happens.
• But they're hoping for more consistent performance.

Sterling Inc.

• Sterling Inc.
• is still using the Sansan Tomoe River in their bound planners, but for their loose sheets, which are for like Plotter, Filofax, that kind of thing.
• They are using Cosmo Era Light.
• Interesting.
• I think I just saw that today.
• I maybe saw that from your TLDR.
• I saw that link.
• Probably.
• Yeah.
• That's interesting.
• That's, yeah.
• I mean, I think that's one of those things that like the pen community should be interested in.
• If you like Cosmo Era Light, you might want to consider switching over to Sterling Inc.
• this year.
• And then Aura Estelle, I think is also still, no, they said they found new paper too.
• I thought they stayed the same.
• No, they did all those tests.
• Because I was watching the videos.
• Yeah, they did that testing video.
• They tested a ton of papers and they decided that the Sansan Tomoe River was the best of the options.
• But this, you know, and I think she said it in her video.
• Like this is one of those things where it's like we as pen nerds are super picky about our paper.
• And some people love Tomoe River.
• Some people don't.
• Some people love Cosmo Era Light and some people don't.
• Some people love Midori paper and other people don't.
• So it's one of those things where it's like when you find that formula that you like, support the companies that are making products on that paper.
• Yeah.
• And like just for like clarification purposes and correct me if I'm wrong, like these small companies got hung out last year just like Hobonichi did.
• Because they're buying from the same batches from the same printers or at least through the same sources.
• So they're getting hit with these inconsistencies and like that's super affecting.
• So they've put a lot of time and effort this year to get ahead of some of the questions that they're going to have.
• And for their own sake, right?
• Like we're going to have to switch if this doesn't work.
• And I think they found so far everything's, you know, knock on wood seems to be going pretty well with the season's paper.
• But like did you ever think that you were going to be discussing this like in your lifetime?
• That we had these seasonal batches of papers?
• There are two things I never thought I'd ever talk about.
• Tariffs and Tomoe River paper obscurity.
• Like honest to gosh, two things.
• And they both hit in the same year.
• Yeah, exactly.
• Exactly.
• Well, like I had a note and I wrote it as a joke saying like will Hobonichi make it through this year?
• And I'm literally joking because it's clear that they are like Hobonichi's not going anywhere.
• I have some of my own arguments with some of the way they've handled last year and going into this year.
• Like I haven't been very happy with like some of the marketing.
• But for like just general purposes, I'd like them to have a good year.
• Like they're good for our industry, honestly.
• Like just in the getting people to talk about stationery and then eventually, you know, maybe finding something from Aura Estelle or, you know, Sterling Inc.
• It's kind of an entry point because it's such a well-known name brand.
• Like I don't want them to fail or anything by any means.
• But like I do have some issues with how they've done things.
• Yeah.
• And, you know, some of the issues of the products coming into the U.S.
• from Hobonichi are a result of the tariff problem.
• So like a lot of the retailers were not able to bring in certain products because of the whole like their covers are made in China, but the actual books are made in Japan.
• So as long as there's a book included, they can list the product as being made in Japan, which is a lower tariff rate than if it says it's made in China.
• So there's like there's they specifically did not offer cover only for you at the U.S.
• market because of this or retailers weren't bringing in cover only because those would be charged at the 34 percent tariff rate, which.
• Yeah, that's these are already expensive products.
• Yeah.
• And, you know, some of the prices re-upping every year.
• Yeah.
• And some of the prices did go up and some people buy new covers every year.
• Some people just buy covers.
• I mean, like an A5 Hobonichi cover works with any A5 notebooks that you don't have to use.
• You know, so like there are some people who just want the covers.
• So there may be a very robust secondary market for old covers.
• You know, that's interesting.
• I didn't think about that.
• Yeah.
• Well, I mean, legitimately, like I think that's something that's for me a place that needs to be rediscovered or reconsidered is if you have used a Hobonichi cover all year and you want to upgrade or change to a new cover or you went from an A6 and now you want to use an A5.
• So now you have a cover that you don't need.
• Sell it on the secondary market.
• Like give people an opportunity to try these products and maybe not have to pay full price.
• Like if you're done with that cover, like move it along.
• Like there's nothing.
• There's no harm, no foul.
• I know that there are some super collectible, super beautiful covers, but like a lot of the nylon covers, like just, you know, start buy, sell, trade, you know.
• Yeah.
• I'll swap you the blue cover for a green one this year or something.
• Yeah.
• Yeah.
• That's a great idea.
• Speaking of some of these frustrations, how important to you is your effing birds planner and calendar?
• That's Laura.
• Oh, is it Laura?
• That is 100% Laura.
• Someone told me to ask you.
• I didn't realize that was hers.
• That sounds like you though.
• It does.
• But that does sound like Laura too.
• Yeah.
• Knowing her like I do.
• She loves her effing birds and she loves to talk about it on the blog and she has gotten some unpleasant feedback from people who think it's unacceptable language.
• Sure.
• Sure.
• But so she actually asked me, she's like, I am going to get another effing birds planner.
• Can I post about it?
• And I'm like, absolutely.
• And she's like, well, what if somebody gets mad at me again?
• And I'm like, so they get mad at you.
• Like.
• Yeah.
• There's probably an effing birds for that.
• But it's, it's one of those things like it makes her happy.
• Yeah.
• I think, you know, I mean, it's such a crazy, silly idea.
• This guy purchased all of these like, you know, sort of Audubon illustrations and then just pulls random, like writes silly things in word balloons coming out of these little critters mouths.
• So like.
• Yeah, that's great.
• It's definitely struck a nerve.
• I'm a huge fan and have some, I have a whole set of postcards that someone sent me because I like to do postcards and they're glorious.
• So that was one of the bits of feedback.
• I said, hey, I'm interviewing Anna.
• What do I need to ask?
• I did not think to go look and say, oh, that's actually Laura doing that.
• So tell her.
• I said, good job on the effing birds.
• Well, I'm sure she'll listen to the episode.
• She said she's got, she works for a company that is like about an hour and a half from her.
• So she mostly works remotely, but once a year she has to drive because they host a big event and it's like all hands on deck kind of thing.
• And so she has to do that next week and she'll be driving back and forth.
• So she'll listen to it.
• And I'm sure I will get texted all the things I forgot to mention.
• Oh, yes.
• I'm sure.
• I'm going to give you that opportunity now.
• We'll wrap this up here pretty soon.
• But like what else do you want to talk about?
• Like I definitely want to end this with you plugging all the things.
• But like before we even get to that, is there anything, anything we need to hit?
• I don't know.
• So I was talking before we signed on that I was in the process of cleaning a bunch of pens because I have decided to try Derek over at DWRDNet on YouTube.
• I hope I got all the letters in the right order.
• That was correct because I link to him all the time and always have to double check.
• So he talked about a platinum preppy challenge to spend an entire week using nothing but like platinum preppies or some other sort of like entry level bargain basement fountain pen.
• So I was cleaning all of the platinum preppies.
• And apparently I have way more than I thought I did.
• I have like five.
• And his thing was actually using the cartridges that they come with.
• But I realized I didn't have enough cartridges.
• So I did actually fill a couple empty cartridges.
• And then I did not use black ink in all of them because ink.
• I know.
• I know.
• Well, I would at least steal the blue black ink.
• I think they might ship maybe sometimes a blue black ink.
• But I like the little challenges like that, right?
• Doing those little things like that to make you just use your stuff.
• Like last year, I've just been writing about it again.
• I'm not going to do it again this year.
• But I did Ticonder October where I only use pencils for the month of October.
• It was fantastic.
• Like it was so good.
• And like I love those little challenges.
• So I'll put a link in the show notes to that.
• And then you just did your own little challenge by our friend Lisa over at Olive Octopus Inc.
• Anna answers the 12 pen person questions list.
• I thought that was fantastic.
• I'll put a link in the show notes to that.
• How fun was that to do?
• It was really fun.
• And we were, Laura is going to do her version next week.
• And so we'll have another one.
• But I think it's really fun to, the questions were very thought provoking.
• It wasn't just like, what's your favorite pen kind of thing.
• It was very much like thinking about and talking about how we're using the tools and our involvement in the community and that kind of thing, which I thought was really interesting.
• So kudos to Lisa for the great questions.
• Yeah.
• And I'll just go ahead and blow your cover for the superlative.
• It was fantastic.
• You gave it yourself.
• The most likely to have ink smudges on her hands, which the picture I'm like, oh yeah, this is great.
• Yeah.
• Like you're showing me right now on the video, ink smudges on the hands are mandatory in this.
• And me talking to you multiple times a year is mandatory for my sanity.
• I love talking to you.
• I appreciate all the time you spent with me today.
• Thank you.
• So tell everyone where they can find you on your site shop.
• I will have all the links in the show notes in case you miss it, but I still want you to plug yourself.
• So you can find me at the wellappointeddesk.com and along the side of the page are links to everything else, our shop, our Patreon, our Instagram, like that's all there.
• So hopefully you'll find everything at wellappointeddesk.com.
• No dashes, no spaces.
• And it's a whole lot of letters.
• Yeah.
• It's a, it lives in my browser history.
• So it's just, it's easy for me to type.
• So I am Brad, you can find me at penaddict.com.
• Everything I do is linked over there, including this podcast, the Twitch streams.
• I'm currently in the middle of raising money for St.
• Jude during childhood cancer awareness month.
• Ana, spoiler, we're going out of time here.
• Ana recorded with me last week for this week's episode because I am in Memphis about to do the podcast-a-thon live from St.
• Jude.
• So thank you again, Ana.
• You're welcome.
• For getting this in early.
• And yeah, that's it.
• That was episode 683.
• Thank you to our sponsors, Squarespace, Factor, and Enigma Stationery.
• Thank you so much, Ana.
• And last question for you, any more pen shows this year or are we putting a bow on it?
• I got one more.
• I'm going to Dallas.
• Dallas.
• I was going to say, as soon as I said that, I was like, oh, I bet she's going to Dallas.
• Dallas it is.
• Yep.
• That's a regular stop for you.
• And if anyone is at the Dallas Pen Show, be sure to go see Ana.
• Who are you going to be working for there?
• I will be hanging out at the Drumgoals table.
• I will be the boss of ink and probably paper.
• Yep.
• So go see Ana there.
• And thanks again for listening to us talk about pens and stationery and all the things that we love.
• Until next week.
• Say goodbye, Ana.
• Goodbye, Ana.
• I trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust trust